deadly conditions.

[oleg]

I have a planet with Unpleasant conditions. Random event that decrease planet conditions happens there. According to events.txt file, conditions change by -20 (AIC game). OK, I have Nature shrine III in the system. +3 per year. How much would it take to restore conditions ? 20/3~7 years ? I waited 200 turns (20 years) - it is still deadly !!! Other planets went all the way to good/optimal, so NS works.

But what is wrong with that planet ???

[ September 13, 2003, 14:33: Message edited by: oleg ]

[Alneyan]

It seems like you cannot improve the conditions of a Deadly planet. (I just tried to do so myself, nothing after a few hundred turns) My race was even Impressive in Environmental Resistance, but that didn't do anything at all. (Reproduction is still 0% )

Second test, this time with a race focused on Reproduction. (150% Environmental Resistance, 130% Reproduction and 150% Happiness) The reproduction on this planet is no less than 32%, but the conditions are still deadly after 300 turns. (Thanks to the book holding the F12 key)

It would make sense after all, do you imagine being able to transform a planet where you can barely live at all into a paradise?

[ September 13, 2003, 14:48: Message edited by: Alneyan ]

[Suicide Junkie]

Note that the conditions improvement plants only kick in on every 10th turn. (turns ending in 24XX.0)

Given 300 turns though, and a CI 3 plant, the planet would have improved by +90%

Were you running a finite resources game, perhaps?
For finite resources the value improvement plants multiply with the value, rather than add. Conditions improvement may do the same thing, and as we all know, zero times anything leaves you with zero

PS:
They do stack fully, so building 5 CI 3 plants on a planet makes conditions improve by 15% per year.

[Alneyan]

Suicide Junkie, both my tests were made in a regular game, with the stock game, but it is the same in AIC and TDM so I gather it applies to every mod. Perhaps you need an even longer period of time? But that would seem unlikely.

I will try to see what happens after a few thousand turns. (With a book holding the magic key obviously) I was myself using the CI3 facilities, and Oleg tried the Nature Shrines, which are usually working quite fast (a few years).

[Fyron]

Conditions are stored as a variable ranging from 0.00 to 1.50. Conditions improving facilities improve by .01-.03. So, after 200 turns, it should have improved by .60. IIRC, the lowest threshhold for Unpleasant is .70, so dropping by 20 should have made it .50, and 200 turns should have brought it to 1.10, which is Mild IIRC.

Are you certain there is no other event with the same label and such that could have dropped it by more than 20 (.20)? If the conditions dropped to 0, they would have to be raised by around 70 to hit unpleasant again (I think that is the lowest for unpleasant, though I am not certain).

[Alneyan]

Fyron, I used a Deadly planet made thanks to the editor for my own test. Could it change the outcome? I will try with a starting condition as low as possible, but other than 0.0, perhaps you cannot increase this variable if it reaches 0.0?

[Rollo]

true, if the conditions were indeed 0 the improvement plant will not help. The plant multiplies 1.03 with the current value, not adding 0.03.
So, 0*1.03^20 is still 0.

Rollo

[ September 13, 2003, 18:05: Message edited by: Rollo ]

[Alneyan]

You are indeed right Rollo, I tried with a value of 0.1 and more than 400 turns later, I managed to have conditions of Harsh. Way too long to be worth it obviously. I will now be trying to see what happens with 0.0 after a *very* long period of time. (Even if it should remain 0, no matter how many years go by, perhaps there is another factor helping such planets?)

[Fyron]

Umm... are you sure it multiplies? I could have sworn it adds... must test this again.

[Alneyan]

No, contrary to what Rello thought (and his idea seemed to be reasonnable), it does not multiply as I was able to go to 0.0 to Harsh condition in 39 years (or perhaps slightly less). The evolution is *very* slow though from Deadly to Harsh, much slower than from Mild to the best for instance, but don't ask me why.

So you have to wait for another 20 years Oleg before having the pleasure to see the transformations of your planet, or you could build ten CI plants. (My tests have been done with a level 3 CI, so you could speed up the process a bit)