[Beginner] Pointers about magic usage

[Alneyan]

As you can guess by the title, I was wondering about the best way to use magic when you are still learning the ropes, and how to design your Pretender magic paths.

While for now I have been having some success with *Coughs* the ever-so diplomatic Ulm, my Pretender did not do much in these games, which were won because of the low number of Normal AIs around, and not because of some clever strategy. My Pretender was then bases around Earth (5 if memory serves), with a few additional paths. (Mainly Water and Air) As it wasn't exactly used besides forging some items, I would like some advice about how to design a magic Pretender.

With a Nation strongly focused in a single path, should my Pretender pursue this path as well, or should I go for another complementary path? And likewise, would it make more sense to complement a nation strong in a single path with a Pretender focused in a single path as well, rather than using a Rainbow Mage? (And vice versa)

I am not asking for an advancer strategy, but merely for a few pointers to have a good beginning with the game. Thanks in advance for any help!

[Gandalf Parker]

Of course the standard answer is that there are many MANY different ways to do this. Its one of the great things about the game. You have to test. Not for the best thing, but for the best thing that matches your playing style.

OK anyway, for me I prefer to compliment my nation. I only have so much I can spend on my pretender so I figure that I should use it to give my pretender magic in any area that is NOT already covered by the nations mages.

Some additional considerations are:

1 can give you access to useful equip. Not only a wider variety of basic things but some items need multiple paths. As far as I know just having one in each can fill that requirement

2 or 3 in a magic is good for searching

3 is needed in many paths to make the piece of equipment which can grant a mage an additional level of that magic, which will often give you access to making some other piece of equipment to give ANOTHER level in it.

4 or more in a magic is good for special effects added to the blessing that priests can do. Mostly important to "sacred" troops if you use them alot.

9 in a magic gains an additional and powerful effect to the bless spell

Astral is special. There is a magical attack which compares the levels of astral magic. If you take astral then you should take alot of astral

[ March 29, 2004, 15:46: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

[Cainehill]

Caveat - relative newcomer to Dominions myself.

As Gandalf said, 2 to 3 is good for searching. Myself, I'm kind of partial to 4 - not only does it grant the bless effect, some of which are kinda handy (extra defense, extra magic resistance, 20% of not getting hit by missile weapons) even at that minimal bless level. More importantly - from what I understand, you never need more than 4 in a magic path to find _all_ sites in that path.

Maybe it's just me, but I hate micro-managing my mages, "Ooh! I have a fire 4 mage now, I should send him to check all the provinces I only checked at level 3 before!" With 4, you [i]know[i] you found 'em.

Again, similar to what he said, I like my pretender to complement the nation's magic, so I can search (and cast) for magic the nation can't itself manage. But I also like to have at least one path that matches up with the kind of magic gem income the nation has. This allows me to forge items (since being able to forge a -great- item but having 0 gems of the required type isn't very fun), and also allows some synergy from magic research. If there's at least one shared path, you can research to get a spell that's great both for the national mages and the Pretender - I prefer not to research to a level that only gives a benefit to one or the other.

Besides forging, another reason to have at least one magic area in line with the nation/theme's strengths is summonings. Maybe you're not having much luck expanding, so your army is stalled, with upkeep nearly matching your income. Being able to get a couple decent summonings off with your pretender can make a big difference. (Most summons require gems, and more than a few have a better effect according to the mage's magic levels. If lvl 2 gets 1 summoned creature for 2 gems, lvl 3 gets 2, and lvl 4 gets 3 creatures for the same 2 gems, etc, it's better to have a pretender with better than mortal magic skill in that area.)

Hth.

[ywl]

Originally posted by Alneyan:
As you can guess by the title, I was wondering about the best way to use magic when you are still learning the ropes, and how to design your Pretender magic paths.

While for now I have been having some success with *Coughs* the ever-so diplomatic Ulm, my Pretender did not do much in these games, which were won because of the low number of Normal AIs around, and not because of some clever strategy. My Pretender was then bases around Earth (5 if memory serves), with a few additional paths. (Mainly Water and Air) As it wasn't exactly used besides forging some items, I would like some advice about how to design a magic Pretender.

With a Nation strongly focused in a single path, should my Pretender pursue this path as well, or should I go for another complementary path? And likewise, would it make more sense to complement a nation strong in a single path with a Pretender focused in a single path as well, rather than using a Rainbow Mage? (And vice versa)

I am not asking for an advancer strategy, but merely for a few pointers to have a good beginning with the game. Thanks in advance for any help!

There are no fix rule. To me, it's more a general design of your strategy, with your pretender factor in as one of the chess pieces. One example:

Trampling Death for Ulm. Ulm is strong in Earth and Earth magic has a very powerful item at Construction 2, "Boots of the Behemoth", which let your pretender trampling ability. Trampling inflict armor negating damage and a well protected trampler can easily take out 100+ heavy infantries. Its downside is being too tiring and the fatique on your pretender will pile up until he/she becomes unconscious. The only exceptions are when he has 0 encumbance, such as Prince of Death. Another consideration for Ulm is their poor magic diversity. The magic paths that could compensate this short-coming are Nature and to a lesser extent Death. One good pretender design for Ulm will therefore be a Prince of Death with 3 to 4 nature and 3 to 4 death. Then you go for Construction 2 at the beginning, giving the Boots and other Earth base protective gears to your pretender. Later in the game, go for Conjuration 6 or higher, so that you have access to more magical paths. An additional benefit is the spell "Summon Ghosts" at Conjuration 6. With a high death caster, like your pretender, this spell gives you very good units at a low gem cost. You see: everything just comes together with a relative low point cost .

Ideally, you can design your strategy for all nations like this. It's like making a recipe, and your components are your regular units, all the spells, items, the bless effects and the different kinds of pretender chassis...

Sorry if I'm not giving your very concrete advice but sometimes, you just need to be creative and read the spell book harder .

[Alneyan]

Thanks for the pointers! I didn't expect a guide such as "How to become God/Goddess/Omnipotent Being in three easy steps", so such advice was what I had in mind.

I will toy around a bit with these other toys with Ulm, as it does seem to be effective. (Much more than my previous Pretender, but it was hard to think of some worse design)

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by ywl:
Trampling inflict armor negating damage and a well protected trampler can easily take out 100+ heavy infantries.

Trampling is armour piercing, not armour negating.

[mlepinski]

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:
Trampling is armour piercing, not armour negating.

This may be a stupid question, but what is the difference between "armor piercing" and "armor negating"?

- Matt Lepinski :->

[ March 30, 2004, 04:27: Message edited by: mlepinski ]

Armor Piercing = 1/2 Protection Value for Damage.

Armor Negating = 0 Protection Value for Damage.

[velk]

I think an important thing to keep in mind while designing a magic pretender is how well your troops fit in with the kind of magic power you are aiming for.

In general, unlike supercombatants, magical pretenders are going to need to have troops with them to stop them being overwhelmed while they are casting. So you need to keep in mind what troops you are going to have available for your nation.

Some of these are obvious - the battlefield death spells are going to be as dangerous to your troops as they are to the enemy if you use primarily living troops - and some are not so obvious - such as does your nation have a mage capable of casting thunder ward so you can get wrathful skies out an extra round earlier because your pretender does not have to cast it.

One other note I guess, is that it depends a lot on whether you are aiming for multiplayer or single player. Nothing you are going to do will suprise the computer, but taking something non-standard that doesn't have immediately obvious advantages can be devastating to multiplayer opponents simply because they were not expecting it.

The best way is probably going to be to experiment - there are so many subtle touches to dom2 that it is extremely difficult to make a plan in isolation.

[PrinzMegaherz]

You could, as an example, go for water magic. That would allow you to lead your troops into the sea and conquer some provinces your enemy can't attack.

I would not recommend to have a single high path, as there are no sacred Ulm troops.