Advis again F9W9 for ctis

[wolfkinsov]

Any thoughts on how C'tis can stand up to Jot woodsmen with Fire 9 and Water 9. I mean with other races I would say crossbows or longbows but with ctis a lot hard to get those things. I have Death 9 and Nature 4.

[Graeme Dice]

The power of C'Tis lies in its powerful mages. Sauromancers are the most powerful death mages available, and Shaman are cheap enough to use as communion slaves to cast all the nature and astral spells you want.

Your normal troops are primarily designed to delay your opponents and give your mages enough time to do their work. Drain life is an excellent combat spell against living units, as you will never run out of fatigue while using it. Raise skeletons allows you to flood the battlefield with units to wear down the enemies. Your fire 1 sauromancers can cast banefire, which is an extremely powerful combat spell. You also have access to soul slay through the use of teams of four shaman acting as communion slaves with one master. This is the bane of powerful but expensive units with moderate magic resist.

If it's a fire 9/water 9 Jotunheim, then his economy is likely going to be quite poor. As long as you can defend against his armies, then you should be able to prevail in the long run.

I would also suggest summoning a few bane lords and equipping them with flying boots, jade armor, and wraith swords. Regen rings are nice, but not necessary. They probably won't be able to take on a Jotun army by themself, but will work very well in combination with your troops and mages. Just remember that each Jotun woodsman needs to kill at least five of your troops to win the economic war.

[wolfkinsov]

Thanks that is what I thought, or rather I should have started a topic of if the game maker does difficult of very difficult research then 90% of what you suggested can't every be accomplished. While Jot, Ulm, and a few others start out at there peak. I guess I just got out manuvered on races.

[Huzurdaddi]

Holy bejesus! W9F9 ?!?!

What the heck did he do to his nation to acheive that! Wowzie.

I would *love* dearly love to get a blessing like that ( but I would not use it on Jotunheim seeing as their sacred troops are marginal, unless you are taking about Niefelheim in which case their sacred troops are fantastically powerful but very costly ).

I just tried it out.

Disorder 1, Sloth 1, Cold 3, Misfortune 1, Drain 3, dominion 6, Fortress.

Yoikes. That's a pretty high price to pay.

I wonder how that will work my Water blessing race par-excellence Vanheim? Hmmm. Could be devestating! But sadly Vanheim does not get the 120 free points for cold 3 ( only 40 free points ).


Can you imaging a Van with a W9F9 blessing! LOL! It would be insane!

[Yossar]

Hydras with W9F9 are insane, but also make your nation very one-dimensional.

[wolfkinsov]

Actually you can get it fairly easy with the Son of Niefel. Go Drain 3 (no big deal if your not planning on magic since it is very difficult research) Cold 3 (Again no big loss for jot) and Misfortune 1 and you have Fire 9 Water 9 Domain 5 and the 30 admin fortress. The Woodcuters have a strength of I think 25 so all Indies pretty much die in one hit and compared to what you get there blessed troops are cheap. 55/11 Try it and watch them cut up indies. Not something you would try on a normal research but he will grow fairly big before running into say Ulm.

[archaeolept]

yeah, the very difficult research really sets things out of whack. that's why on IRC we call the game "Retarded", which seems quite literally accurate.

Scales are horrible, but not unmanageable given the rich setting of the game. The trick w/ Jot bless strategies, IMO, is exactly what is held out as the "marginal" nature of Jotun woodsmen: their low armor.

Because of their crap armor, their resource cost is minimal. I can get by w/ sloth-3 for the Jots when doing a heavy bless strat. that goes a long way towards paying for the bless effects.

OTOH, my pretender is pretty useless

a c'tis water 9 serpent dancer w/ poison slinger strat would do fairly well against W9F9 jots. but base c'tis troops would seem to be very weak against such monstrosities.

You could always try negotiation

I know I currently have little desire for a war over there. As well, the territories in question are getting fairly close to my capital, so perhaps pushing that direction of advance is not in your best interest...

[ April 27, 2004, 07:31: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

[Huzurdaddi]

Actually you can get it fairly easy with the Son of Niefel. Go Drain 3 (no big deal if your not planning on magic since it is very difficult research)

Hmmm just tried it with Vanheim and I was able to get F9W9, well, well, well. Of course I took drain 3 like you are saying.

Now all I need to do is get some chumps ... I mean people to play a game with very hard research and I am set!

HoHoHo F9W9. That's going to make for some funny troops.

Perhaps I should try to get the map to be small too, that should make it painless at least.

[Norfleet]

Originally posted by Huzurdaddi:
Disorder 1, Sloth 1, Cold 3, Misfortune 1, Drain 3, dominion 6, Fortress.

Yoikes. That's a pretty high price to pay.

That almost seems like suicide: Turmoil AND Misfortune? I would have traded down to Sloth-3 for Order-1, maybe another tilt of Misfortune for Order-2, and maybe a hit of death for Order-3. Turmoil and Misfortune don't mix.

[Jondifool]

interesting question!

how C'tis is to stand up against the blessed woodsmen with W9F9 in a low research setting ?

I don't know the answer at all (still newbie), but I couldn't resist thinking of what I would try.

if expecting a woodsman F9W9 i could be tempted for the heck of it to ****er with a molock W9F9 (and terrible scales) but serpent dancers with base defense 16 should now be able to standup to the woodsmans beating for a while and doing some damage in return. but they are (as i remember) capital only.

Good scales and maybe starting with severe patrools could give an gp advantage on more than 50%, adding up to have more than 5 troops for each woodsman. (until jotun outgrows c'tis). But how to damage them as ther water blessing makes them hard to hit.

A combination with a water 9 pretender and scales for the rest. For fodder and serpent dancers, might be a solution.

With the setup for c'tis D9N4 that is asked for here i can not really comes around anything. Except trying to gamble with battle setups. And offcause take the heat to the opponent , but without a stealthy priest thats not working.

with machaka i would have tried the nation spell starting spell blind. Would terror work ? If time and space for a few lost battles Could it work to curse them ? (should be in research range)