Faerun - Pending Update, Need Opinions

[NTJedi]

Of course I have the ones which were updated months ago. With so many recent new postings I figured a new updated map was on its way.
I believed the point of people listing their likes and dislikes about the map indicated another update was coming.

[BigDaddy]

This is a Really Great Map, and I've played many games on it. We play with random start locations. The biggest problems occur:

1)Because it takes forever to get to a plain State from the jungles of Chult - maybe these should be no starts.

2)The Anaurock is far too easy to take. Normally, in a game you can get a waste or two, and yes they are easily taken, but on this map you can have 15 wastes and 3 or more swamps with a minimally strong starting army. The gem income is rather staggering. I'm not sure exactly how to fix this, but either stronger/special defenses, or more difficult movement through the area could help. . . And don't get me wrong I LIKE the Anaurock, but maybe it just needs toned down a little.

[tinkthank]

OK, once again sorry for having posted feedback on an out-of-date version.
I tried some more on your New and Improved Version, and it really is MUCH BETTER.
"However..."
I think I can put my finger on why it is still not my map of choice, under one caveat: You should not take this personally, and I believe very strongly that the two reasons I will give are purely a matter of completely subjective, highly contingent taste, and have no bearing whatsoever on your skills as an excellent map maker. In fact, I think most people will disagree with me, which is of course just fine. So this is just my humble opinion:

1. It is too big. I think I really don't come clear with anything over half its size.
2. It is too "busy". By this I mean there is too much "shiny stuff" which, because it looks like information but is not, detracts from my (admittedly: instrumental-functional) finding what I want in an unambiguous manner. Examples of these are the many lines (streets, I think? or other forms of borders?), points (representing, I think, cities), and words. I really like the "pretty bits" (things that look like mountains, or little islands, or rivers), however.

Well, I hope you will accept this honest bit of feedback for what it is, and thanks very much for all your efforts!

[Edi]

Thanks for the comments.

No, I'm not taking your criticisms personally. To each his own, and if you like maps about half the size of the Faerun maps, there is nothing wrong with that.

The reason there are those roads (major trade routes, really), cities, region names and so forth is that the map is a scan of the FR role playing game map, not something really made with a strategy game in mind. The graphics are nice enough on the map, better than on the old 2nd Edition maps, but those had a charm all their own, though. Personally I like the region names and country names being on the graphic itself, because I much dislike the province name filter in Dom2, it is too unaesthetic for my tastes.

I have the Waterdeep and Kara-Tur trail maps, and I would have made the map with those if there was any way to do it without mangling them beyond all recognition. But you would need one big-*** scanner (as in 1.5 meters by 2.5 meters) for that.

Edi

[NTJedi]

Considering that this map is the largest map created by a person... it is not too large. If there was 20 other maps with 400+ provinces then people can say its too large. No one else has even dared to create one as large... so Edi is KING in my book. The fewer limitations a game has the greater the replay value... example-Neverwinter Nights.
If the map editor is more user friendly in Dominions_3 I will gladly make some.

[The Panther]

I am playing an MP game (as Atlantis) for the first time on the large Faerun. We used the Soapy mods which prevent clam hoarding. It is turn 83 or so and I have about 100 provinces, second only to C'tis. I must say it is a fine map and very pleasing to the eye.

The problem with Vanheim has already been noted. As Atlantis, I encircled Vanheim and then killed him at my leisure. It was no contest for him and I lost almost nothing, taking all the Vanheim islands (15 provinces) in 5 turns.

I thought the Calimport defenders were fine. I took it kind of early just to keep Marignon from grabbing it and getting the Navigators. I took some losses but it was worth it to me, and that was the location of the first fort I built. Any tougher defenders would mean it would sit there a bit longer unclaimed. The way it is now makes for interesting strategy between Atlantis, Marignon, and Machaka as to when to try to grab it and suffer the necessary losses during the early game.

The defenders on Mezro Jungle need to be modifed. I attacked it with a priest on hold and retreat about 5-6 times. This caused just about all the non-poison immune troops (including most of the commanders, the Jade guys, and Amazons, iirc) to eventually die to the hydra poison cloud. All that remained was to get the poison resist spell for my W9 Mother Guards and take it much too cheaply.

Vanheim had not taken Myrloch Vale when I killed him. I hit it with 8 ghost riders and killed most everything, allowing me to capture it without loss. It did seem very tough for sure. Certainly Vanheim thought so, for he left it alone.

I also took Waterdeep on turn 70 or so (nobody up there thought it worth capturing obviously) and it was an easy battle due to my huge army by that time. I remember sacking a few dozen earth trolls and water trolls to get it. No big deal to me, though it obviously was to Pangaea and Ulm who both left it alone.

I cannot comment on the other side of the map, not having seen much over there.

As for the map being too big, it really is. The main problem is that any MP game with 17 players will have frequent stales, some people going AWOL, several quitting to AI periodically, and such typical things like that. In my current game, there is much of this going on (as usual). Thus, there is really at most 10 players truly playing in any large game, which means big maps play even larger than they really are. My gold income has topped 8K and my gem income is nearing 300. That makes for very long turns. I pity poor Huzurdaddi/Soapyfrog playing C'tis, for his micro-management requirements are even worse than mine right now. Even on 48 hour QH with at least 1 person staling every turn, it is still too much to me to squeeze in full turns every time.

Well, I do thank you for all the time you put into making this map.

Panther

[Edi]

Thank you for the well thought out feedback, Panther. I'd forgotten all about the problem with Mezro, but currently that is the only unfixed issue. I did beef Calimport up a bit by adding a bunch of flyers in there, but nothing too tough considering all the rewards.

Point taken about the lack of players, the large map really does require every position to be filled, the smaller one can miss a couple of the more centrally located players.

I've started some preliminary work on a pint-sized Faerun, but that's currently on hold as I explore options for getting my hands on the electronic versions of the Waterdeep and Kara-Tur trail maps. Those together represen the kind of Faerun I wanted to do from the get-go and I just had to settle for the western half. If I can get them in a form that allows me to do the whole Forgotten Realms (minus Zakhara and Maztica), the current Faerun map will look and feel like only a rough sketch in comparison.

Edi

[Saber Cherry]

Edi said:
I've started some preliminary work on a pint-sized Faerun, but that's currently on hold as I explore options for getting my hands on the electronic versions of the Waterdeep and Kara-Tur trail maps. Those together represen the kind of Faerun I wanted to do from the get-go and I just had to settle for the western half. If I can get them in a form that allows me to do the whole Forgotten Realms (minus Zakhara and Maztica), the current Faerun map will look and feel like only a rough sketch in comparison.

Edi

Neat, I'll look forward to both the pint-size and the real deal