Mods of vehicles.

[Steelwolf]

I am trying to figure out how to create a OOB file that has some modifications in weapons on aircraft and tanks.

As with the modifications done in the field during WW2, or as in the Sherman MODS done by Israel, adding larger mainguns.

The reasoning behind this idea began with a chat dealing with the possibility of a modern american civil war.

After discovering what is available for purchase in the US, ranging such as t72's etc, as well as US surplus aircraft, I began to actually consider what would happen.

Following the theory that weapons and other items salvaged from damaged enemy vihicles, and the other possible modifications of tanks such as sand bags to suppliment armour, even welding additional plates of steel in places that are weaker than one would want.

Some of the thoughts i had were like M60 tts tanks upgraded with captured guns from damaged M1's, not to mention the possibility of M1's starting in the hands of a new confederate army.

I also figure that in a campaign, the assets of a new confederate army and air force would be limited, needing to be supplimented with captured equipment, or overseas purchases.

Any ideas on how to do this in the oobs would greatly help, and after campaign is created, I would gladly upload it.

Besides, being a Texan first, southerner second, american only because the dang yankees won the war of northern aggression, I firmly believe the south shall rise again...
and if we do, the north gets to keep G.W Bush, he was born in MASS.

[pdoktar]

Read the mobhack manual and start experimenting. It´s quite easy but time-consuming, especially if you´re a newbie and trying to make a whole campaign, but if you have the time, and you don´t quit (like I usually do).

Forget the sandbag up-armouring though, it´s bull. Just use steel plates..

[PlasmaKrab]

Good idea, that could make a funny campaign. Go on!

Thinking about it, you can edit most of the stuff from the scenario editor, as long as you have US units swapping US weapons (e.g. an M60 with an M1 gun as you said). Try to generate a scenario (any kind) and in the deploy phase hit 'D' with a unit selected, there you can edit the unit's name, weapons, armor, FCS, vision... you name it.

Did you give much thought into the political whereabouts of this campaign or is it just meant to be a wild what-if? (would be fine too, no worries)
I'd be interested in knowing what parts of the country are supposed to break away from what, and why. After all, it's not as if cotton culture was still all the rage these days...

[Steelwolf]

Actually, I was figuring the scenerio of some nutjob president manufactoring a reason to declare martial law and cancelling elections.

When you consider that under such a situation, federal troops would be on city streets, and the fact that most of the civil rights now enjoyed would be a thing of the past, everything would go up in flames fast.

I would figure states or areas that have a low approval rating of the president would break quick, along with the independant militias who already think the federal government is too controlling would move as well. (If you use the present polls of Bush's approval rating, the total number of states breaking away is about 34)

Also, being that I have some native american ancestors, I figure there is still enough bad blood with the BIA system to get a lot of support off the reservations.

Considering that a quick internet search found former soviet, syrian, egyptian T72's, Iraqi T82's (sold as captured material for scrap, and now being resold as 'collectors items') BMP's, BTR's, British Armour such as the NATO chieftan which can handle any maingun the Leopards or Abrams can, along with SPA units, Mig 21's, 23's, 24's and 25's crated and never flown WITH spares, MI24 Hind gunships, minus guns, ordinance, weapons of various calibers and uses, and a large number of EX US Navy patrol craft all of which is for sale in the states to local citizens.

It is my opinion, that an Independant Militia would have no problem equipping itself with armour that would at least have somewhat of a fighting chance against the Abrams.

National Guard tank units are equiped with obsolete Abrams models, and these are stored within the state, so if a state was to break away, or even a national guard unit was to rebel against what it percieved as an illegal presidential order, the varied equipment fielded by a new confederacy would be at least partially able to deal with modern armour.

The major issue really is to figure out just how much a break away force would have available. This is another area that would be good to explore as far as creating the campaign.

I have been experimenting with a Viginia Tidewater area scenerio, with the opening day being a combined force of Mech Infantry and MP's moving to detain an independant militia and secure a National Guard Equipment depot.

Using tactics from WW2 where Shermans had to deal with Tigers, i.e, shot the sucker in the butt, I have managed to deal effectively with Bradley's, and using nothing more than militia units, have managed to secure the depot.

I have not been able to deal a major blow to the US forces, and end up with a marginal victory, and the fact the survivors would be calling for reinforcements.

In other words, the night between day one and the morning of day two would be air strikes on the militia held posititions, and day two would have units from Quantico moveing to support the survivors.

Unless the depot has a substantial supply of infantry SAMs, vehicles and ordinance, the militia would have to withdraw from the combat zone.

[PlasmaKrab]

IMHO how it turns out in the long run would be as much a matter of international politics, e.g. which coultries support which side. You could actually have either hard-pressed rebels or a staggering central government supplied from overseas, though I don't know if they would need that much.
F.e. a total embargo on oil products would end manoeuver warfare and air combats quickly enough, except if some domestic oil industries are left standing.

As far as captured units are concerned, I'm not sure there would be enough left of them to build a fighting force. AFAIK there should be a couple dozens each of several Russian tank types around, same for planes, helos and arty, most without much ammo, and more importantly, without many trained mechanics. Stuffing a new gun in an old tank is nice, but that's not something you do in the field with a blowtorch and a disk saw, paticularly when you don't know the vehicle itself.

Besides, refitting captured Iraqis early-80s T-72s to fight Abramses would be suicidal.
Deal with that as you want, maybe I'm being to rigidly realistic here, but I'd tend to see militia forces striving to capture active or reserve (regular or NG) equipment and bases, as you said, and/or sticking to local vigilante-level irreg forces, most of which armor would be made up of civilian trucks with makeshift armor and pintle-mounted weapons.

Anyway, if you want to go for the captured-refitted thing (or units supplied from overseas countries and refitted, sau surplus Challengers, etc.), you just have to buy these units as captured and then give them the weapons and ratings you like, all in the scenario editor.

[RecruitMonty]

What about MILGOV and CIVGOV? I came across those names whilst looking up crack-pot theories about an invasion of America by the Soviets, Chinese and some other damned country. MILGOV stands for Military Government and CIVGOV stands for Civilian Government. In the story line of this particular game (at least I think it was a game) the USA is nuked sometime in the late 90s by the Soviets (along with lots of other places) after the two sides have been going at each other for a while. The USA splits between a Military government and a Civilian one (the Chiefs of staff and surviving Senators etc have different ideas about the way the USA should put itself back together. The Civil war is described as a low intensity one. The story isn't so important but the two names are.

[Steelwolf]

PlasmaKrab said:
As far as captured units are concerned, I'm not sure there would be enough left of them to build a fighting force. AFAIK there should be a couple dozens each of several Russian tank types around, same for planes, helos and arty, most without much ammo, and more importantly, without many trained mechanics. Stuffing a new gun in an old tank is nice, but that's not something you do in the field with a blowtorch and a disk saw, paticularly when you don't know the vehicle itself.

Besides, refitting captured Iraqis early-80s T-72s to fight Abramses would be suicidal.
Deal with that as you want, maybe I'm being to rigidly realistic here, but I'd tend to see militia forces striving to capture active or reserve (regular or NG) equipment and bases, as you said, and/or sticking to local vigilante-level irreg forces, most of which armor would be made up of civilian trucks with makeshift armor and pintle-mounted weapons.

Actually, you are thinking along the same lines as I am. Now, as for stuffing a new gun into an old tank, well, I would think that going from a us gun into something like the M60 would be difficult, but not impossible. A heavy equipment shop such as used for construction equipment would be the perfect place.

As for the use of the T72's. They would, as you said, be useless against the Abrams, but as far as supporting Mech Inf units and basically being used as mobile pill boxes, they would be acceptable.

As far as political situations, my personal opinions aside, with the laws passed after 9/11 to deal with terrorist groups, the executive branch was given much to much leeway in how to act. Thus, a president with a personal agenda could, in fact, declare martial law and a state of emergency, suspending congress, and using the military to maintain order.

When 9/11 occured, there was no allowances for martial law, now there are. However, I dont really think a president would make such a move unless it was necessary (I hope) and in that case, he would have the support of the citizens.

But on the offhand chance a president did try to use the system to his own ends, the situation would get out of hand quickly, IMO.

Now what gets me is this:

You have to register firearms, however, you can purchase a tank and not have to register it with any government agency.

[RecruitMonty]

"Now what gets me is this:

You have to register firearms, however, you can purchase a tank and not have to register it with any government agency."


wtf?

[Steelwolf]

Yep, you can buy a tank and not have to register the blasted thing, In fact I can give you the web addy for an outfit in Houston that has quite a few on hand....

[RecruitMonty]

really... cool, I'll take it then. Thanks a lot.