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August 5th, 2008, 01:05 AM
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General
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Japan
Posts: 3,691
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Undead/Demon prophets
I think it was K who pointed out that undead Sauromatia priests can reanimate longdead horsemen, and other nations get special souless/longdead.
Who has capital D or 2S income and benefits from making a prophet out of a Black Servant or demon priest? Some nations also need an awake god with death in order to be able to cast Black Servant.
The Prince of Death also gives free longdead, but it looks like they are always unit #194 (unarmored, broad sword).
The list is:
EA
Arco: alchemy, D god, nothing special
Marverni: alchemy, D god, nothing special
Ulm: D god, nothing special
TC: D god, nothing special
Agartha: nothing special
Fomoria: nothing special
Helheim: nothing special
Pan: Needs ND god for Carrion Centaur; gets three manikins instead of one
CTis: lizard longdead with a few extra HP
Kailasa: alchemy, D god, monkey longdead/soulless, great ghouls
Lanka: monkey longdead with more HP
Yomi: turn 2 Oni General prophet
Ermor: nice longdead with tower shields
Nief: gets nice longdead giants
Sauromatia: reanimate longdead horsemen
MA:
Arco: alchemy, D god, nothing special
Ermor: not needed
Pythium: alchemy, D god, nothing special (but undead work well with Hydras)
TC: alchemy, D god, nothing special
Pan: Use Carrion Centaur; gets three manikins instead of one
CTis: lizard longdead with a few extra HP
Bandar: alchemy, D god, monkey longdead/soulless, great ghouls
Ashdod: gets nice longdead Rephaites
Shinuyama: nothing special
LA:
Arco: alchemy, D god, nothing special
Ermor: not needed
Ulm: D god, nothing special
Marignon: alchemy, D god,
TC: nothing special
Agartha: nothing special
Caelum: can make slightly better soulless
CTis: not needed
Pan: not needed
Utgard: nice longdead giants
Gath: alchemy, nothing special
Atlantis: can make cool soulless
Bogarus: alchemy, D god, nothing special
"nothing special" just means the longdead raised by the prophet are regular longdead. They can still be useful if you need to fight a bunch of hydras or an Awe-Fear SC god.
Of the 'nothing specials', here's my list of nations I really won't be doing this with:
Bakemono: Weak priests, and weak starting army. Needs prophet who can preach and help expand. Also it's nice to make Kurofumi your prophet when he shows up, requiring that your current prophet do the honorable thing and jump in front of an elephant. So it's not worth the trouble of making an undead prophet to start.
Fomoria, Helheim: Prophet will be too busy blessing to sit around raising undead.
Pan: Not worth the trouble.
__________________
Whether he submitted the post, or whether he did not, made no difference. The Thought Police would get him just the same. He had committed— would still have committed, even if he had never set pen to paper— the essential crime that contained all others in itself. Thoughtcrime, they called it. Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever.
http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?
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August 5th, 2008, 01:28 AM
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First Lieutenant
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Join Date: Feb 2007
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Double check the versions of Atlantis. Some get undead with coral armor.
Neifleheim also gets giant longdead. Other giant nations may also.
Caelum gets winged longdead. I think they are only size 3 and not really special.
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August 5th, 2008, 01:42 AM
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First Lieutenant
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Reno, Nevada
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Sauromatia doesn't get longdead horsemen... they have 1h living priests. Anyone else could do the same by prophetizing a black servant or other undead summon. Not sure why you would single them out when anyone can do it.
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August 5th, 2008, 01:54 AM
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General
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Japan
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Renojustin, Sauromatia is the only nation besides MA/LA Ermor whose H3 Undead or Demon priests get the 'reanimate longdead horsemen' command. I'm talking about summoning a Black Servant as soon as Conj-1 is researched, and making it my prophet.
K, thanks for the info. I tried Atlantis, and they do get their own special soulless. It's more troublesome to test the soulless than the longdead, of course. I'll give it a shot though. (PS I called Niefelheim 'Nief' because I'm lazy). I didn't check Atlantis except in LA because it's too troublesome for water nations to make a Black Servant.
Edit: For the nations with easy access to undead prophets, I also saw these soulless:
CTis get Soulless lizards.
Nief/Jotun gets giant Soulless warriors
Monkeys get soulless Bandar/Vanara/Markata
LA Atlantis get souless with a Coral Cuirass
LA Caelum get rotted-wing soulless that can't fly
__________________
Whether he submitted the post, or whether he did not, made no difference. The Thought Police would get him just the same. He had committed— would still have committed, even if he had never set pen to paper— the essential crime that contained all others in itself. Thoughtcrime, they called it. Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever.
http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?
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August 5th, 2008, 02:22 AM
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Lieutenant General
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Utopia, Oregon
Posts: 2,676
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Fomoria doesn't get Longdead Giants? Poo.
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August 5th, 2008, 02:44 AM
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General
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Japan
Posts: 3,691
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Thanked 397 Times in 200 Posts
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Not according to my completely unscientific testing.
__________________
Whether he submitted the post, or whether he did not, made no difference. The Thought Police would get him just the same. He had committed— would still have committed, even if he had never set pen to paper— the essential crime that contained all others in itself. Thoughtcrime, they called it. Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever.
http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?
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August 5th, 2008, 03:48 AM
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Lieutenant General
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Utopia, Oregon
Posts: 2,676
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Well damn your nonscientific method. Jesus rode a dinosaur, wanna fight?!
How did you test btw? I'd put an hour into that myself, just to see. I really like Fomoria, they have that neat gianty-goodness, without that special Niefelheim feeling that you're exploiting the game completely.
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August 5th, 2008, 04:22 AM
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General
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Japan
Posts: 3,691
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Thanked 397 Times in 200 Posts
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
I just tested manually: create a game in each era, all human nations, Death on the pretender just in case. I used easyspell.dm to give all spells to avoid research hassles.
Hit 'End Turn' 5 times, then see who can summon a Black Servant (except Yomi and Lanka, they can make a Demon prophet on turn 2, though Lanka probably doesn't want to because its demons already have H). Summon the Black Servants, alchemise pearls if needed. End Turn. Tell the Black Servants to reanimate. End Turn 5 times, and look at what's in the provinces.
For Soulless, I had to make the armies actually attack a neighbor, moving the prophet in and animating soulless.
__________________
Whether he submitted the post, or whether he did not, made no difference. The Thought Police would get him just the same. He had committed— would still have committed, even if he had never set pen to paper— the essential crime that contained all others in itself. Thoughtcrime, they called it. Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever.
http://z7.invisionfree.com/Dom3mods/index.php?
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August 5th, 2008, 04:29 AM
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Lieutenant Colonel
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Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Florence, Italy
Posts: 1,424
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Quote:
JimMorrison said:
Well damn your nonscientific method. Jesus rode a dinosaur, wanna fight?!
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?
???
P.S. nice list vfb. Tnx for the time you spent doing those tests. I had seen the lizard and giant longdeads but I missed the Caelum ones and others... gonna give a look
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IN UN LAMPO DI GLORIA!
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August 5th, 2008, 04:54 AM
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First Lieutenant
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 773
Thanks: 2
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Re: Undead/Demon prophets
Quote:
vfb said:
For Soulless, I had to make the armies actually attack a neighbor, moving the prophet in and animating soulless.
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Heh. I just pillaged my home province and pre-set to Reanimate Soulless.
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