Helicopter Ammo reload

cbreedon · #1 March 28th, 2011, 11:52 PM

Hi I have a question regarding reloading helicopters ordinance.

I was playing the Soviets vs Mujaheddin in 1979. I had a firebase with 6 mortars around an ammo truck. I also had an Mi-24 with rockets. I was using my Mi-24 and ran out of ammo so I flew back to the ammo truck and landed on it. A couple of turns later, it was reloaded and I went back into the action and ran out of ammo again. I did the same thing but this time, they were not reloading my helicopter. During the entire game I was using the mortars.

Is there a reason that the helo wouldn't re-arm? Is the a limit on how many times a helo can reload or maybe is there some limit on the ammo in the truck?

Thanks

RightDeve · #2 March 29th, 2011, 12:16 AM

No, there is NO limit to supplying. What you just experienced is a mere probability check, where some units would be resupplied while the others not for a given turn. Also, since the number of your mortar units sucking the ammo is quite numerous, there's a lower probability that your helo will resupply at a given turn.

That's why I think putting some ammo units in a certain PBeM settings is quite gamey

iCaMpWiThAWP · #3 March 29th, 2011, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RightDeve

No, there is NO limit to supplying. What you just experienced is a mere probability check, where some units would be resupplied while the others not for a given turn. Also, since the number of your mortar units sucking the ammo is quite numerous, there's a lower probability that your helo will resupply at a given turn.

That's why I think putting some ammo units in a certain PBeM settings is quite gamey

Wheni play pbem we usually agree on no ammo containers, makes uber weapons too powerful

whdonnelly · #4 March 29th, 2011, 04:35 PM

There is a protocol that I have forgotten, but it is possible that a unit such as J1 or J2 won't reload until an adjacent unit with a higher letter is fully replenished.

Mobhack · #5 March 30th, 2011, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whdonnelly

There is a protocol that I have forgotten, but it is possible that a unit such as J1 or J2 won't reload until an adjacent unit with a higher letter is fully replenished.

Highest unit in database order - which can be different to letter, if some formation swapping and cross-attachments have been done.

Only the one unit is serviced - unlike the original games where you could park an infinite number of units around one ammo unit and all would get supply to an equal level.

I may well look into adding a negative test for either side of the equation firing as well (to stop folks banging away with arty and humping new shells into the racks at the same time). Load or fire - not both.

Andy

EJ · #6 March 30th, 2011, 05:37 PM

Andy,
I agree with that idea. That way you will have to use your ammo WISELY or run out of indirect fire support.

gila · #7 March 30th, 2011, 07:44 PM

[/quote]

I may well look into adding a negative test for either side of the equation firing as well (to stop folks banging away with arty and humping new shells into the racks at the same time). Load or fire - not both.

Andy[/quote]

But when arty fires when rearming they give their position away, so it will take away getting an hit on a ammo unit and blowing up everything adjacent to it as it's rearming them.
This is like finding a gold mine in pbem games

RightDeve · #8 March 30th, 2011, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mobhack

I may well look into adding a negative test for either side of the equation firing as well (to stop folks banging away with arty and humping new shells into the racks at the same time). Load or fire - not both.

Andy

Well, I think the current supply mechanism (esp. for artillery) is quite, good... It simulates the status of "Stockpiled artillery", in which the artillery pieces have saved a good number of shells for later use, hence the "seemingly unlimited" number of rounds they possess in-game (without having to stop firing to "reload"; arty isn't like small arms in terms of reload mechanism, note)

Sure this rule should be discussed first prior to a PBeM game; and I DON'T think the application of which is realistic except for certain situations.

FASTBOAT TOUGH · #9 March 31st, 2011, 01:58 AM

From the AI game play point of view, I'm a propionate of ammo units as in "real life" being a part of the make up of my units, I've personally found over the years and across the patches I do pay a "reload penalty" in the the amount of turns regardless of the units experience level between fire missions for my artillery units is in the area of 1.5 to 2.5 turns. Given modern tech in rate of fire and reload capabilities this would seem reasonable as is in the game now and on par with any off map arty being used. The only advantage is sometimes my on map units might shoot longer. This is many times negated by the fact that the AI really doesn't like on map arty very much and you'll pay the price if you don't "shoot and scoot" which within the game is again a limiting factor as you pay a "movement penalty" as well.
With helos (tanks etc.) and ammo resupply even with experienced units I've seen this process take a min. of four to five full turns on average and it always seems it go from machine guns to ATGW in order of reload, also that's with no other units in the hex.
Maybe PBEM games play differently, but sometimes I feel as though we're talking about two different games within the game. And this is not a knock, I just don't have the time to devote to a PBEM game and god knows it's hard enough to get an AI game in these days. If I could change one "major" item in the game and had the smarts to do it, it would be to let the AI buy ammo units if it chose to, for at least it's armor and on map arty.
From a Player vs. AI prospective I think it works well as is, because in real life ARCHER, CAESAR, PALIDAN and others are paired with ammo carriers (And have automated reload systems and can still fire.) and also can fire, move and fire again in 30 to 45 seconds. This will only open up another can of worms of real life vs. game reality. And I don't enjoy fishing as much I used to anymore.

Regards,
Pat

RightDeve · #10 March 31st, 2011, 03:05 AM

Haven't I said it depends on the pre-game agreement? It also depends on the battle circumstances; I have repeated that at least twice here. Well, you yourself just opened that can here I think. I am not against those who put ammo units on the battlefield, nor I am with those who chose to put. I myself had played PBeM with ammo units in; but that is of course from both part's agreement first, and that when the battle circumstances permit.

Putting ammo units on the battlefield can be either realistic, or, gamey. It depends.

No, there's NO such thing as two different games between PBeM and AI. The only thing different from those two is what we call "THE BRAIN". Gameplay etc they're still the same.