USA/USAF Units in USMC OOB

[Suhiir]

Unit #109 CH-3E JG Giant (USA OOB #897 HH-3E JG Giant)
Unit #126 F-80 (USA OOB #125 F-80, #940 F-80)
Unit #193 OH-6 Cayuse (USA OOB #279 OH-6A+ Cayuse, #280 OH-6A Cayuse)
Unit #216 A-26A Invader [Bomber] (USA OOB #152 A-26 Invader, #854 A-26 Invader)
Unit #220 B-26 Marauder [Bomber] (USA OOB #132 B-26 Marauder, #853 B-26 Marauder)
Unit #222 A-26A Invader [Bomber] (USA OOB #152 A-26 Invader, #854 A-26 Invader)
Unit #252 OV-1 Mohawk (USA OOB #687 OV-1A Mohawk, #688 OV-1D Mohawk, #689 JOV-1C Mohawk)
Unit #298 M548 Ammo Carr (USA OOB #523 M548 Ammo Carr)
Unit #303 M3 Ammo Carrier (USA OOB #845 M3 Ammo Carrier)
Unit #313 MH-53J Pave Low (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #314 MH-53M Pave Low (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #521 F-82 Tw Mustang (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #570 AC-47D Puff (USA OOB #563 AC-47 Spooky)
Unit #571 AC-130A Spectre (USA OOB #824 AC-130A Spooky)
Unit #572 AC-130E Big Gun (USA OOB #564 AC-130H Spectre)
Unit #573 AC-130U+4Spooky (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #577 B-52 [CBU Incendiary] (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #579 B-57 (USA OOB #133 B-57)
Unit #580 F-111A (USA OOB #594 F-111A)
Unit #581 F-111F (USA OOB #592 F-111F)
Unit #582 F117 Nighthawk (USA OOB #931 F117 Nighthawk)
Unit #584 F117 Nighthawk (USA OOB #593 F117 Nighthawk)
Unit #585 B-52 (USA OOB #932 B-52)
Unit #588 B-1 (USA OOB #374 B-1)
Unit #589 B-2 (USA OOB #948 B-2)
Unit #590 RF-4 WildWeasel (USA OOB #577 F-4 Wild Weasel)
Unit #591 F117 NiteWeasel [SEAD] (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #609 AC-130J Spooky (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #614 AT-28D Trojan (USA OOB #863 AT-28DTrojan)
Unit #620 B-26K Invader (Not in USA OOB with same weapons load)
Unit #621 B-26K Invader (Not in USA OOB with same weapons load)
Unit #625 A-10 Warthog (USA OOB #870 A-10 Warthog)
Unit #626 A-10 Warthog (USA OOB #871 A-10 Warthog)
Unit #627 A-10 Warthog (USA OOB #151 A-10 Warthog)
Unit #903 F-111F (USA OOB #578 F-111F)
Unit #904 F-22A Raptor [SEAD] (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #908 F117 Nighthawk (USA OOB #931 F117 Nighthawk)
Unit #916 B-26K Invader (Not in USA OOB with same weapons load)
Unit #917 B-26K Invader (Not in USA OOB with same weapons load)
Unit #948 F-22A Raptor (USA OOB #595 F-22 Raptor)
Unit #949 F-22A Raptor [COIN] (Not in USA OOB)
Unit #990 M548 (USA OOB #846 M548)


Unit #298 M548 Ammo Carr (01/65-12/20) replacment exists as #301 Ammo Amtrac (01/56-12/73) and #302 Ammo Amtrac (01/72-12/20)
Unit #303 M3 Ammo Carrier (01/46-12/64) replacment exists as #300 Ammo Amtrac (01/46-12/55)

[DRG]

Ok I deleted my first response becasue I'm sure it would have burnt the eyes out of anyone who read it but lets just say I'm not real happy at the moment so I'll just reduce this down to three simple questions.

1/ Please explain WHY having a A-10 in the USMC OOB is an issue ? A-10's have never supported USMC in battle ?.....Ever ?

2/

Unit #620 B-26K Invader (Not in USA OOB with same weapons load)

Please explain WHY it's an "issue" for you that an aircraft in the USMC OOB ( the ONLY OOB in the game specifically for sub branch of a nations armed forces ) MIGHT have a different weapons load than one in the parent US OOB?

3/
Please enlighten me why it's an issue that a version of an aircraft may exist in the USMC OOB that does not exist in the US OOB ( that has 18 free unit slots left )

???

Don

[Mobhack]

Plus - if you require USA OOB support - there is the allies function already, designed precisely for that purpose.

Andy

[DRG]

Yes Andy but half those units were added to fill out the USMC OOB before the allies button was even thought of and the the other half ( like the Navy Helos ) were added because It was believed logical that they might be available to USMC. I don't recal ANYONE ever thinking someone might make an issue of it and nor was it thought that having a slightly different weapons load between units in the US and USMC would be an "issue" either but yet....here we are.

"Unit #916 B-26K Invader (Not in USA OOB with same weapons load)"

Really....... which one ? There three in the US OOB and FOUR ( gasp ! ) in the USMC but they are two types of COIN aircraft in the US OOB and COIN and FB in the USMC ( which just might explain the difference in weapons load and given there were a lot of ways to load up a aircraft the question again is....so whats the problem ? Are we just pointing of there are differences between units in the game ? Well DUH there's almost 36,000 units in MBT. There will be differences, it's not chess

Don

[Suhiir]

The Allies function Andy mentioned is the primary reason I brought this up.

I thought it might be worthwhile to eliminate duplicate units in the USA/USMC OOBs (why I indicated the ones with no duplicates - i.e. "(Not in USA OOB with same weapons load)"} to reduce (in the long run) the workload of maintaining the two OOBs.

To the best of my limited understanding the intent of having two OOBs for the USA in the first place is that the US Army/USAF and USMC/USN are sufficiently large, and different, military services that it's impractical to have just one USA OOB. And that keeping each OOB "accurate" as to the weapons, units, and formations would help reinforce those differences.

I intentionally did not mention that the B-26 variants were NOT used for close air support, they're were dedicated interdiction aircraft used vs the Ho Chi Mhin Trail, thus outside the scope of WinSPMBT.

You may note that I did not suggest what should/could be done with the information provided, I merely took the time to cross reference the OOBs and point out duplicates. What you do, or don't do, with the information provided is up to you.

As to the Navy Helo's.
There's not a lot of call for anti-submarine warfare on dry land, and whatever anti-ship capability they may have the Navy tends to prefer to use keeping their ships safe, they're funny that way. Dedicated SAR helos might be considered outside the scope of WinSPMBT, thus might be be safely eliminated as irrelevant to the game, much like fuel trucks.

[DRG]

NO.. what you did as drop a list with NO explanation at all of what the purpose was or what "Not in USA OOB with same weapons load" actually meant so "garbage in...garbage out" 3 minutes typing an "explanation" the first time would have save a lot of aggravation and misunderstanding.

Go back to that first post, clear your mind of any personal understanding of what you were trying to convey then tell me if it makes any sense to you based on your last post

What exactly am I to make of "Unit #579 B-57 (USA OOB #133 B-57)" with no explanation or did you just ASSUME I would know what you meant ?


Don

[Suhiir]

Let's say I've become leery of offering anything but purely factual information concerning aircraft in the game.

[DRG]

OK that nice but it does not explain the lack of an explanation that was offered for that list aside for two notes at the end related to ammo carriers.

??

I get a post that titled "USA/USAF Units in USMC OOB" and then "Unit #577 B-52 [CBU Incendiary] (Not in USA OOB)"

OK...... it has a different ammo load but it's still a "USA/USAF Unit in USMC OOB"



Don

[Suhiir]

Noted.

[-Luc-]

Hi,

I dont know if I understand well but... I think to have a special OOB for important army aviation (US/RU/GB/FR) is a good idea.

It could free a lot of spaces for groud units.

It could (Allies system) create some interesting possibilities.

I dont know if its possible and it will need a lot of work but the idea is not bad.

Thank you,

-Luc-