Battle of Mokra

[DRG]

....more because I tried to not re-enforce failure.

[wulfir]

Originally Posted by BigDuke66

Anyone played that scenario(# 270)?

Hello BigDuke66!

I'm the guy behind that scenario. I know it's a bit on the easy side when playing the Poles - but I Think that's ok, the 4th Panzer Div did get a bit of a thrasing at Mokra and again outside Warszaw a few days later.

I want scenarios to be more of a surprise than perfectly balanced. There is a great variation in "skill level" between players. Some veterans are absolute demons at this game, what is hard for them is near impossible for newbies and so on.

Usually though, most scenarios I have made will favour player 2 (the side meant to be played by the AI) and will be easier when played by a human vs the AI.

However, I don't remember modyfing the FlaK guns though I guess I did... (?)

[BigDuke66]

Well a surprise it was when the first tanks got killed by the first shot on almost 1km.
Don't get me wrong "balance" isn't necessary here, the setup should be like it was historically and the scenario should try to point at the historical outcome but the "tricks" to shift the way the scenario runs to get the result you want were somehow "unfair" in my opinion.

Indeed the 4th did have problems on that day and later again at least judging by some first hand accounts of German officers, but as I said the setup seemed shifted in an "unfair" way with German tanks without HE ammo, Krad units that can't get off their bikes and Polish Pak that gets XP & moral high above other polish units and even German units.
Of course the missing "Smialy" must be compensated but I wonder if there isn't any other way to do that.
I tried the scenario with the Paks set to normal values and Krad units changed to the once that can disembark and the gameplay was much more fun on the German side simply because it didn't frustrate me with the feeling of having a hand tied behind the back, if I had added the HE ammo for the 2cm guns of the German tanks I guess the gameplay would have been even more fun.
The AI still did a good job and got tank kills but this time leaving some tanks for the AT-rifle units. The Krad units did their job as recon but got off the biles when things started to get nasty and the tanks also did their jobs with some weapons between the usually MG and the 7,5 HE rounds that the Pz IV can throw in.

I would go for a setup in this manner and give something to the Poles to compensate form the missing Smialy(some bunkers on the rail line maybe?) instead of tuning the Germans down and the Poles up in a rather strange way.

PS Regarding the "old school" units used I have a similar problem with them in your scenario 356 Prosna Bridghead.
The inability to dismount bicycle and horse units is also very frustrating as it seems to me that these units are easy to kill, but of course on the other hand the Poles use dismounted troopers that have no transport assets(their horses) at all.
So if both sides would simply go for the real McCoy using the unit types that can mount/dismount the transports(horses & bicycles) it would be a fine improvement of the scenario.

PPS Just playing your scenario 272 and I love it, really teaches the player how to use smoke for a covered approach but also how to use artillery and MGs to suppress the enemy, and also to circle around strong points like bunkers to take them out.
After the player has done this scenario he should be much more capable of using his infantry & artillery in concert but also to handle situations even such assaults without any tank support.

[wulfir]

Originally Posted by BigDuke66

I would go for a setup in this manner and give something to the Poles to compensate form the missing Smialy(some bunkers on the rail line maybe?) instead of tuning the Germans down and the Poles up in a rather strange way.

I think you might be right about that, and it would be pretty easy to fix.

As for the old school mounted units - I understand the limitations of not being able to dismount them - and yes they are vulnerable - but they can be useful even to a human player. Especially cavalry is dangerous to battered enemy formations and damaged units in a tight spot.

[DRG]

Ulf

If you wish to issue an update to this sceanrio at any time I will be happy to put it into a patch. I had planned to change the Krad units to the newer dismountable versions and have a look at the German ammo issue.

Don

[wulfir]

spscn270 - PzII tanks replaced to variants with HE ammo and the exp/morale of the Polish AT guns have been reduced.

I didn't touch the mounted units for either side but feel free to change that, or anything else of course.

[Firestorm]

Originally Posted by BigDuke66

Either by using secret nazi weapons like this :


Or because

The first one in my case. I think this is the one where I once traded out all the German tanks for M-26 Pershings. Poles won anyway, mostly because I'd given them a cavalry unit consisting of fireball-throwing Hellsteeds.

I've done some weird things to my OOBs...

Originally Posted by BigDuke66

PS Regarding the "old school" units used I have a similar problem with them in your scenario 356 Prosna Bridghead.
The inability to dismount bicycle and horse units is also very frustrating as it seems to me that these units are easy to kill, but of course on the other hand the Poles use dismounted troopers that have no transport assets(their horses) at all.
So if both sides would simply go for the real McCoy using the unit types that can mount/dismount the transports(horses & bicycles) it would be a fine improvement of the scenario.

I've already done this for both Poland and China; creating custom Mounted Infantry/Dismounted Cavalry similar to the US/German equivalents. Dismounted bicycles? I know the Swedes have it. Never saw the need to copy it, even though I use bicycle cavalry heavily when playing the Poles (they make excellent tank riders, odd as that may sound).