PoD vs. VQ vs. Liches (was: Blood Arco mod)

[Scott Hebert]

Originally posted by Zen:
That means a mage that is a rainbow (Has multiple paths) and Immortality. Previously to the patch any nations (meaning all) would not pick a Lich instead of a VQ because they had the exact same path costs and an additional path to boot. Now, the VQ can only pick 1, maybe 2 paths within any sort of reason to be built into a SC. So instead of VQ's with 2E, 3D, 1W, 3+A we will see one with just 2 of the 3 core paths of magic to do the exact same kind of damage that it did before.

Right. I understand this, at least.

I do not see it this way. A PoD is an Indy Killer first, support mage second. With the right equipment early enough, he can do very well, but he is still very prone to afflictions, very prone to death and only has 2 option of healing them.

True. I would say this combines into 'you have to be more careful with a PoD than a VQ', but I find this all well and to the good.

A VQ can fight within it's domain as a pure killing force that can stand to die and lose and if hurt can heal afflictions. The PoD is not so limited by Dominion only.

Agreed. I guess, to the developers, Immortality is indeed that powerful?

They all share the same weaknesses, and those liches are more combat oriented than the normal lich. But compare whatever lich you want and you'll see their basic function is different and now the VQ can't fullfill both roles, only one.

True enough. The Lich and the VQ are now on a much more even keel, comparatively. My only concern here is the one that IW themselves brought up; namely, that very few people play with Liches. It would seem to me that if you balance a Pretender against a Lich, they should be played at about equal frequency. Which means bad things for the VQ.

I don't find it to be so. It's not as if every patch that Pretenders have been removed from specific nations. What I would find disconcernting is that the Warlock and Skratti are gone and haven't made it back from sabbatical.

With the removal, it's more of a question of timing. It certainly doesn't _look_ like it was done for thematic reasons. I trust IW, but other, less trusting people probably won't.

Then those that play MP that don't agree on a Mod will have to come to an agreement or accept the fact that the Dev's changed it for a reason they felt was appropriate to do so.

Right. But it does reduce the power of your 'well you can just mod it' argument. Considering the various other improvements in 2.12, I certainly think you'd want to mod 2.12 rather than not patch and stay at 2.11.

Sorry that your BE, Blood Ermor was taken down. It certainly wasn't aimed at BE and if there was a way to change Pretenders based on theme, I'm sure you would have seen a different change. Unfortunately we have to work within the parameters of the game mechanics until such time as those mechanics change.

Oh I know. It was something of a facetious complaint, and it's not like I can't use a Ghost King instead to get Blood magic on my Pretender at a non-ridiculous price. It _would_ be nice to have Pretender selection on a theme basis, rather than a nation basis. I think that's a little beyond the scope of the current gamestate, though.

Anyway, the BE Blood idea is not a very good one. I just like the fact that BE Ermor has such easy access to undead patrollers. Jotunheim is almost as good, except theirs is all gem-based, and they need gems for undead commanders as well. Desert Tombs and Black Forest suffer from a death scale. BE Ermor's problem is, obviously, a lack of good Blood mages.

Ah well. Maybe I'll have to rectify that.

Scott