.com.unity Forums
  The Official e-Store of Shrapnel Games

This Month's Specials

Raging Tiger- Save $9.00
winSPMBT: Main Battle Tank- Save $6.00

   







Go Back   .com.unity Forums > The Camo Workshop > WinSPWW2 > TO&Es
Notices


 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Prev Previous Post   Next Post Next
  #1  
Old September 25th, 2009, 09:33 PM

sturmovik sturmovik is offline
Corporal
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 54
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
sturmovik is on a distinguished road
Question Maginot Line Fortifications

I was recently doing some research on the Maginot Line and I realized there was an opportunity for several new weapons and units to be added to SPWW2. I have done some preliminary work on these units and I wanted to submit them to the forum.

First are a few new new weapons. The best reference (use Google Translate if necessary) is here, but you can Google additional ones.

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat%C3%..._Ligne_Maginot

I have added the following weapons

Mortier de 50mm modèle 1935 - This is a small breach loading mortar present in most bunkers and all of the Type A light MG cupolas. I basically copied the 45mm Italian mortar and set the range to 700m.

7.5mm FM 24/29D - Port firing version of the standard FM 24/29 LMG. I am assuming it will have the same characteristics as a light TMG.

7.5mm twin MAC 31. - The Maginot Line employed a unique form of MAC 31 tank gun in a twin mounting. These weapons also had water cooling for sustained firing so I upped the kill to 14 from the standard TMG model.

37mm AC37 - Fortress version of the 37mm L53 gun. Rename only.

47mm AC47 - Fortress version of the 47mm L50/53 gun. Rename of the SA37, but available from 1934 in appropriate casemates.

Next are the series of Maginot Line cupolas (called cloches in French). These are the iconic steel domes that graced the major Maginot Line casemates.

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat%C3%...C3%A9quipement
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maginot...moured_cloches

You can get detailed info on their armour here.

http://books.google.com/books?id=8ea...Turret&f=false

The original versions were made from 20cm thick cast steel on all sides and the top, but the gun/vision ports did form a weakness. Here is what I did for each type. Because only the "turret" of the cloches were exposed and the bases set on concrete I uniformly set all of the hull armour values to 50.

GFM Type A - This is the most numerous cloche that was used for general observation and local defence. It was armed with an FM24/29D and by 1940 all had also been fitted with a Mle 1935 50mm mortar. For the floating block firing and vision ports I gave a TF rating of 5.

GFM Type B - These were a later model of the type A with 5cm uparmour on the side and 10cm on the roof. They also had more effective ball mount gun ports instead of the floating block ports of the type A and so I raised the TF value to 8.

AM - Same armour as the GFM A, they mounted a 25L72 gun and MAC 31 on a common mount.

JM - Same armour as the GFM A, they mounted a twin MAC 31.

LG - Mounted a 50mm mortar on the roof with no vision or gun ports. I set the turret armour to a uniform 20, reduced top armour to 8.

Each cloche had a direct phone line to carious fire control centers so this should count as a radio % of 90.

Oh, if you think that 20cm armour ratings will make the choches too tough to attack...that's the point.

Moving on to the turrets if you review that book I liked earlier it confirms that the armour on the sides and roof were a uniform 30cm. I adjusted the TF armour to match the amount drilled away for the weapons ports. For the large mounts I chose 15 for the 75 and 20 for the mortars due to the very high barrel angle. The 75mm, 81mm and 135mm twin turrets were already in SPWW2, but I added a few others that were missed.

Tourelle FM - Twin MAC 31 turret. Due to the openings for the guns and sights I set the TF armour to 10.

Tourelle AM - Mixed weapons turret. Two paired mountings of 25L72 guns and MAC 31 guns. TF rating of 8 due to large gun ports. Second model with an additional 50mm mortar.

Tourelle STG - These were small independent steel MG turrets mounted on a base. Weapon was an FM14 Hotchkiss. Some were on a steel tube base, others were on a larger concrete blockhouse base. Armour was 3-4cm.

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourell...A9montable_STG

Finally perhaps the most delicate issue, Maginot Line casemates. I noticed that most of the ones included followed the standard formula which differed from what was present in the line. A few, like the 47mm AT and 75mm FG were unique to line forts and the details did not match what was present.

First of all, in the major Maginot casemates FM14 Hotchkiss guns were not used, only the single/twin MAC 31's and FM24/29D's. Line casemates were also the only location where the AC37/47 and 75mm field guns were installed. Smaller blockhouses and pillboxes counld mount 25L78 guns as well as 13.2mm Hotchkiss HMGs. Most of these were set up for flanking fire against tanks.

The large casemates had many feet of concrete on the roofs which should warrant a high armour rating. Also, the direction opposite the guns often faced the enemy and had similarly thick walls and additional earth protection. Sides and front walls appear to be about 2-4 feet thick with the gun ports around 4-5cm of steel. Still I don't know RHA to concrete conversions so I haven't firmed up the thicknesses yet.

Anyway, the "Heavy Casemates" with the thick roofs and rears came in flavours of 47mm AT + Twin MGs, Twin MGs, 75mm FG and there were also some 81 and 135 mortar ones scattered about in the alpine region. All of these would have a few FM24/29D's thrown in for good measure.

The lighter "blockhaus"es would have a more uniform 2-4' of concrete protection all around and would sport a 25L78 and some combination of dual/single MAC31 and FM24/29D's.

Finally there were you standard model of pillboxes that would best be modeled by the existing SPWW2 type of pillbox.

Ok, here are some things I need help with.

One thing I noticed was that all of the heavy arty was used for fire support in the surrounding areas so all of the emplacements with mortars or 75's need to be able to appear as artillery support. If the code does not handle this with them set as bunkers or fortifications they should be changed to arty types because they were designed for support, not direct fire.

For the turrets and cloches I need advice on crew levels. Each turret only had 2 guys actually under steel, but there was a larger crew down the ladder so what is the best figure to use?

As I mentioned I need some final advice on the armour ratings for the concrete casemates and blockhouses.

Anyway, let me know what you think and I can make a standard 3.5 OOB available with just these changes.
Reply With Quote
 

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:47 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1999 - 2024, Shrapnel Games, Inc. - All Rights Reserved.