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Old November 21st, 2011, 08:35 AM
Squirrelloid Squirrelloid is offline
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Default Re: Ashdod is worthless now

Ok, the reason I'm frustrated with Triqui is he seems to be offering a false dilemma. This quote sums it up pretty clearly:

Quote:
So you agree with my previous statement, they have 2 ways to play, E10, or losing. Don't you? Becouse you said it otherwise a couple of posts ago. It's hard to follow your "reasoning" with that much flip-flop.
So, please, let be clear:
Is Ashdod a "you must play as this, always, with no other option, period" nation?
No no no no.

Its not a choice between E10 or losing. Its a choice between (*taking a bless for the sacred you have* and using the sacred) OR (*not using the sacred* and doing something different.) (Parentheses provided to be clear on what the choices are since Triqui insists on taking things out of context, like 'them' out to mean Ashdod instead of Anakim).

If you want to use Anakim, you take an ~E10N4 bless, that's just the way it is. No other bless even begins to make sense, even pre-nerf. What would you take? Seriously? Anakim have been specifically balanced around being used with an E10 bless because otherwise they are too powerful with an E10 bless.

Nothing compels you to use Anakim, however. If you don't use Anakim, you can do something totally different.

Pure scales Ashdod works just fine. You probably want to sneak N4 in anyway, but ignoring or mostly ignoring the blessing just means you use more regular troops and no sacred troops. You know, like any other nation who doesn't take a blessing?

Most nations sacreds have a limited range of blessings that make any sense on them. Very few nations have sacreds that work with a wide variety of blesses. No one takes E9 on Shadow Vestals or flagellants. No one takes W9 on Niefl Giants. These things aren't things that CBM should be trying to accomodate because the bless does not make sense for the chassis. If you complained 'E9 doesn't work on flagellants' people would laugh at you. And just how many blesses actually work on Niefl Giants? Are they also a problem because E9N4 or lesser versions thereof is the only bless that works with them?

So you've got a big badass giant sacred troop. When used with a big E bless its perfectly viable. The *nation* is still viable without a big E bless, it just *uses different units*. CBM's mission is accomplished - there's no longer a right way to play (You'd have been a fool to use anything other than sacreds with a big E bless before the nerf, so the nerf actually diversified Ashdod's plausible strategies).

So what is his issue?
Is it that Anakim are unuseable? They clearly aren't - if you take a bless that fits them.

Is it that Ashdod only has one way to play? They clearly don't, I've named two builds that I know work (E10N4 or full scales - and actually, the full range of scales + light E+N blesses also work), and I've got some really bizarre ideas for stuff you might do if you knew something about your starting position before the game began. (Summons requiring wastelands are really obnoxious).

And if you wanted to focus on summons (sacred or otherwise) you have *multiple* pretender choices which provide gems every turn, such as the Monolith, Son of the Sun (fire edition), Lord of Rebirth, and Great Enchantress - all of whom provide 1s or equivalent per turn, and all of which provide gems that you either can use nationally or you have national summons for or both.

And your sacred summons have different issues than your sacred recruitables. Se'irim want a W9-focused bless, Shedim are probably in a similar boat. Malakh don't have the encumbrance issue Anakim do so E4N4 + a few other light blesses might be superior for them. Ditanu are undead and can't use the N bless at all and the E bless of less value.

So I'm really not seeing the 'one right way to play' issue. I'm seeing a 'some units are not worth using if you don't take a blessing for them' issue - but I can think of maybe 3 nations where you'll buy the sacred regardless of what blessing you take, and those are all named Mictlan.

I will completely agree Anakim troops aren't worth using without an E10N4 bless. They aren't supposed to be. This is not the same as saying *Ashdod* isn't worth using without that bless - Ashdod has another ~7 troop options, most of which are viable.
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Last edited by Squirrelloid; November 21st, 2011 at 08:47 AM..
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