A prioritized and hopefully realistic Wish List for 2.13

[Wendigo]

Originally posted by Norfleet:
oftentimes a good tank-killer is most likely to get his best hits in if he can strike before his opponent has raised a whackload of spell defenses of his own.[/QB]

Different aproaches, a superior build (because of its specialization) is as viable as a first strike build, they just work differently.

You're simply trading off your limited 5 spell slots instead of your item slots, and lifedrain still requires fewer.
[/QB]

Not necessarily, as you can get those spells from other mages. It is my experience that a SC (or even a group of SCs!), do not stand a chance vs a small army consisting of a duellist SC plus a few supporting mages.

We seem to agree on all the rest, so I am edditing it out.

[Stormbinder]

Originally posted by Wendigo:
On gaining regeneration & reinvigoration through other means:

quote:

---

This is true, although many more item slots may be required for this: To substitute for not using lifedrain, you need both reinvigoration in excess of the unit's modified encumberance rating, and you need a whackload of regeneration.

Or no items slots at all, as you can gain both externally from spells, while using your slots for duelling gear.

In SC duelling, fights are typically short and brutal, so endurance in the form of perpetual reinvigoration is a nonissue. Of course, this just underscores the idea that tanks and tank-killers, are similar, yet have different requirements. A tank, being your typical SC, requires a weapon that is flexible and useful on the a variety of targets that it may encounter. A tank-killer, an anti-SC, only needs to be able to destroy tanks.

Indeed. Getting into the fight with no fatigue certainly helps (no penalties to att, deff & chance of armour piercing hit), but once you are hacking at each other it's mostly about att vs def, and damage yielded vs protection...and there are better weapons for that than the lifedraining ones, even at lower research levels.

---

You are forgeting that lifedrain *cause* the fatique on the target, in addition to all other effects. That can be very significant, since for example 2 or 3 cheap banelords with wraithswords and jade armor can get fatique level on your SC thought the roof in just few turns, and than kill it. Happens all the time in MP. (and yes, I know that there are counters to it I am just giving an example)

[ July 16, 2004, 10:42: Message edited by: Stormbinder ]

[Wendigo]

Originally posted by Stormbinder:
You are forgeting that lifedrain *cause* the fatique on the target, in addition to all other effects. That can be very significant, since for example 2 or 3 cheap banelords with wraithswords and jade armor can get fatique level on your SC thought the roof in just few turns, and than kill it. Happens all the time in MP. (and yes, I know that there are counters to it I am just giving an example) [/QB]

I am forgetting nothing.

A banelord with a wraithsword will deal 3 out of 4 times no fatigue damage to a 30 protection critter: 19+9=28+2d6 vs 30+2d6

Of course some hits might roll well and get through (assuming the banelord is not dead by then), but you are supposed to have planed for this & have your own reinvigoration countering it.

You can not claim 'multiple bane lords' as part of your argument, as those can easily be both grounded & delayed with a SoS, and bogged down with chaff.

edit: it's rather 7/10 than 3/4 if you want to nitpick, the core argument remains anyway.

[ July 16, 2004, 10:55: Message edited by: Wendigo ]

This is the classic "Will my Duel Wielding Duskdagger Jotun Jarl get killed before he kills the fully equipped Bane Lord"

The answer is the Jotun will win 90% of the time.

Why? Just because of the law of Armor Negating weapons and modestly higher strenght weilders. Duskdaggers work fine on Banelords for the same purpose since they will never fatigue out.

Lifedrain weapons are not a must, they are a generality that is good for most situations because of their benefits, but by and large you will need a swath of different weapon combinations to deal with a competant enemy, not the least of which is a different confirguration of weapons.

[NTJedi]

Would be much more helpful for the developers if someone gathered a list of all the requested changes then hold a poll where people can vote on what they want changed.
Then developers will know which changes are in high demand and which changes are in low demand. A poll would be a hundred times more efficient so the developers don't have to read hundreds of Posts.

Personally I would love to see the prize for the Arena Death Match improved... right now lots of people just ignore the event.

[Gandalf Parker]

A poll could be helpful but would have to be very carefully done. Many efforts along that line tended to be worded coser to "we the mob demand these fixes" rather than the "please and thank you consider this" that our momma taught us.

What would help, and has been done in the past but dropped by people doing it, is to collect all of the suggestions into a list. To keep the list clean and useable by the devs it should avoid too much discussion. The descripts of each item (suggestions, bugs, opinions, avoid categorizing them) could be just 6-10 words and a link to the thread where it was/is/can-be discussed. If such a list could be maintained and items added/deleted as patches come out, THAT would be a great contribution to the forum. And probably worth making sticky.

This is actually one of the most requested things by all of the developers in all of the game forums here. The discussions are great but hard to wade thru to see whether its a new topic they should add to their list. A directory of conversations would be very helpful.

[ July 16, 2004, 16:20: Message edited by: Gandalf Parker ]

[Arryn]

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
What would help, and has been done in the past but dropped by people doing it, is to collect all of the suggestions into a list. To keep the list clean and useable by the devs it should avoid too much discussion. The descripts of each item (suggestions, bugs, opinions, avoid categorizing them) could be just 6-10 words and a link to the thread where it was/is/can-be discussed. If such a list could be maintained and items added/deleted as patches come out, THAT would be a great contribution to the forum. And probably worth making sticky.

Well, since Zen's taken charge of creating/maintaining locked sticky threads on this forum, shouldn't he be the one we ask to take on this highly useful yet tedious task?

EDIT: typo

[ July 16, 2004, 16:28: Message edited by: Arryn ]