Building a Better Pretender

[Cainehill]

Thufir said:
I'm just curious - but why do people ever go for N9 blessing?

As mentioned by someone else, the nature blessing works great for Jotunheim, since all their holy / sacred units and commanders are great burly warriors. (I suppose someone _might_ make one of their mages the Prophet, but the only reason I can see would be upkeep.) Niefelheim really is great with N9, because their sacreds are beefier (if much more expensive) than the Jotun Woodsmen.

N9 also works well with Machaka - the Hunter Lords and Black Hunters don't have the HPs to truly shine with regeneration, but with their very high armor, the regen helps keep them from getting afflictions, while the berserk is very good on them.

Similarly, Golden Age Arco's Wind Lords benefit both from the regeneration and the berserk. It's really the nations with sacred mages that N9 is dubious/tricky for.

[Thilock_Dominus]

Similarly, Golden Age Arco's Wind Lords benefit both from the regeneration and the berserk. It's really the nations with sacred mages that N9 is dubious/tricky for.

Yep, that can be a problem with C'tis mages when they run berserking into the middle of the battle....BAD!
The best thing would keep them as rear as possible.
What would be really worser is N9, on flying sacred units. it would turn into kemikaze pilots!

[Thufir]

Cainehill said:
It's really the nations with sacred mages that N9 is dubious/tricky for.

That makes perfect sense. And thanks for your examples of cases where it is useful. Most of my experience both MP and SP is divided between TienChi S&A, Pythium and Abysia, all of whom have sacred mages.

Berserking regenerating Demons of the Heavenly River in S&A are one scary troop, as well.

Do you get Demons of HR in non-S&A themes? I know from experience that N9 (or anything >= N4) is awful with S&A.

[rylen]

Pretender Wight Mage? Intresting. So, instead of reviving your dead pretender with "Call God" you use the revive Death spell and get a disease spreading mummy? Or am I way off?

Rylen

[Taqwus]

You cast Twiceborn, and then arrange your pretender's death, after which he turns into a wight mage.

Wight mage = humanoid (usual slots), undead, landlubber, retains previous magic levels (unless feebleminded or muted in the process of dying, of course). No worries about disease spreading. Ritual of Rebirth probably doesn't work on pretenders.

I seem to recall that the Demons of HR are S&A-only, but it's been a while since I checked.

On Black Hunters and regeneration, a killed Black Hunter turns into a 55-(or so?) hp Hunter Spider. If that's still sacred, it'd be a pretty mean customer at N9 blessing.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Taqwus said:
On Black Hunters and regeneration, a killed Black Hunter turns into a 55-(or so?) hp Hunter Spider. If that's still sacred, it'd be a pretty mean customer at N9 blessing.

Beware the lousy MR, though. Riderless spiders can't deal with the likes of Soul Slay - or worse, enslavement spells. Think about it if you have to face a strong astral nation.

[Schmoe]

Yes, the MR on Hunter Spiders is pretty much terrible. But I can confirm that the riderless spiders are still sacred, so your bless effects just keep on going.

[Boron]

rylen said:
I'm sure this has been done to death before. Finding the thread though, that's tough.

I'm intrested in general discussion of the pretender chasis, setting the scales, and custom equiping. I'm really intrested in, how to use an immobile pretender.

Boron, I hope you or another strategy guide person will include some info on this.

What about the various humans? I've used the Sorceres occasionally for a cheap rainbow w/ added pearls. The sage makes sense for quick research. I've tried the druid to generate Vine stuff in SP but find, if he just hangs around, he's worth more as research. Has there been a discussion of these folks?

The discussion of special pretenders at: http://www.freewebs.com/dominions2/ in the guides, is great. I'm looking for that w/ normal pretenders.

Rylen

wow 2 days almost away and so much action on the board

@rylen my pretender guide is about 2/3 finished .

my favourite pretenders at the moment are :
-for blessing i find the f9 bless most useful because it is good and you get it so cheap with the moloch
with fire darts + some troops to prevent rout he can kill indies quite well too

-as ulm the master alchemist he is the best rainbow (doubled benefits from alchemy) and ulm can afford . with all other nations i take rainbows only in sp

-vq in lots of variations she is still a very good sc and you don't need to care if she dies
midgame she becomes forger/caster ...

-pod as a cheaper but not immortal sc .



someone mentioned the scorpionking before : if you give him earth 4 + fire 4 and search with him e.g. as abysia it will boost your earlygame income great
for this he is the cheapest pretender + he is ok as sc .

imo mainly though a cheap pretender for early money advantage + lots of scales .

[Evil Dave]

Boron said:
-for blessing i find the f9 bless most useful

To fill in a little more detail: F9 is a triple-threat blessing. It makes sacred troops impressively powerful in combat, it gets you an SC pretender, and it helps build up your economy.

I've found that an E9 cyclops gets similar, tho not as stunning, effects. E9 also benefits sacred mages (and mages with Shrouds of the Battle Saint) with a little armor and reinvigoration.

[Demosthenes]

Abysia with a F9/E9 Scorpion King and horrible scales, going for a Lava Warrior Bless strategy until you get the Blood and Devils flowing is pretty sweet too.

I would even lead my early army with the SK if possible. F9/E9 Magma Bolts is freakin horrible.