Turmoil 3 / Luck 3?

[Rytek]

Abyssia in any of the ages works pretty good with those scales.
If you really want to have fun with it, tack on some death (In description Abyssia is supposed to ignore the income penalty taking death- although I think there was a bug where it was not the case. Not sure if it was fixed) add some Magic 3 and then recruit your sacred/young researchers.

So, Turmoil 3, production 3, heat 3, death 3, luck 3, magic 3.

Abyssia has a really nice hero that can shape change into a demon. And a really nice assasin hero.

[AreaOfEffect]

I thought they just didn't suffer from the supply penalty. Go ahead and design an Abysian pretender. You'll note that the supply penalty just isn't there.

[thejeff]

Unfortunately death scales make Abyssia's already serious old age problem even worse.

[Dragar]

and you probably want a blood economy with abysia, cept maybe EA, so you'll be more inclined towards growth than death from a pop point of view

[Rytek]

LOL, I just loaded up an EA Abyssian pretender with those scales and got Malphas(The shapechanging warlock hero) on turn 3, and the crown of death event in an outlying territory on turn4 (netted 27 death gems).

[JaghataiKhan]

EA Tienchi is really nice with all high res med gold units, a Lord of Fortune for even more extra luck, and Turmoil\Luck dominion. It even fits thematically(Three Kingdoms with chaos), and I remember stacking up HUGE rewards from all events, the 3000 Gold event was awesome.

[Hoplosternum]

I played high Luck/Turmoil in the recent Megagame as Jomon. I was roundly thrashed But not because of this. In this case I think it was Luck 3 / Turmoil 1 rather than the full 3/3.

My thinking was that Jomon's troops are cheap but resource heavy so hard to mass produce and they really benefit from getting finds of gems (they are desperate for Death gems). Plus the mages are cheap (but not sacred). I also put some blood on my Pretender and had started a small blood economy which was still at an embryonic stage at the time of my demise. So I had hoped to later be blood hunting on zero taxes in a number of provinces.

I hoped some big money finds would build my extra forts. And to a degree that is what happened.

I did suffer money problems though. Your capital is well down on an order power from turn one and it just gets worse as every province bordering your forts give relatively less gold too. And each subsequent fort is that much less productive moneywise. Nearly all powers require large quantities of mages for research even if not for battle and their cost and upkeep is just too high in the long run.

A bad scales pick for a double bless or awesome awake SC can work because the pay off is you get more provinces in early expansion and so more income that way. But turmoil/luck just doesn't help with that.

So unless you get turmoil freespawn or are LA Ermor I think turmoil / luck is just weak. Everyone, including big blood hunters, need money.

The real problem is luck is just weak, so boosting it with turmoil just isn't that great. You do get money and gems but it hardly compares to the income boost of many provinces under order. Even with Worthy Heroes the heroes are just not enough and you often pick some up with anything other than Misfortune 3. And there are simply too few of the sylph (??) type good events where you get a free mage which may boost you in paths you don't have. i.e. not many 'special' finds that can really turn your game.

I like luck and take it in SP and sometimes in MP. But it is not a power pick and in nearly all cases I take it for style and know the points would have been better spent elsewhere.

[SlipperyJim]

The main problem with Luck is that it doesn't scale. There are a fixed number of events that any nation can receive in one turn. As soon as you've conquered enough provinces that you hit that ceiling, Luck starts to lose its shine.

On the other hand, Order is the gift that just keeps on giving. Go crazy with it. Conquer 250 provinces. Order will boost all of them.

For those reasons, even though the synergy is not as good, I really like to take a neutral Order/Turmoil scale with my Luck. If you're drowning in pretender points, you could even take a little bit of actual Order. No, you won't get quite as many lucky events at the beginning of the game. Just wait. As soon as you've conquered a mid-sized empire, you'll get plenty of Luck to speed you toward ascension.

[JaghataiKhan]

Also, I will never understand why people use death scales. In small maps it looks OK as Silent Seas is merely a showdown. However, IIRC in huge maps you guys play with as it takes a year to finish must simply have a dead wasteland at the end, as death kills population, the very supply and resource provider.

After all, we fight for the people's hearts except Ermor and R'lyeh, amirite? I want my dominion with fat geese,rich coffee and creamy butter and unlimited Tuna fish sandwiches with sweet pickles!

tl;dr Death is neither helpful nor thematic.

[thejeff]

If you can use those points from the death scales to lever fast expansion and faster growth, your earlier provinces may be a dead wasteland, but you'll have fat new rich ones conquered from your enemies, who have thoughtfully preserved them for you.

And it's certainly thematic for some pretenders and even some nations. A Prince of Death should not be associated with fertility and bounty.