Mod: Rohan! version 1.02 (New Content, few bug fixes)

[fantasma]

I downloaded the mod today and it's really nice, especially the graphics.

I post some suggestions here, which come to my mind, mainly for thematic reasons.

I think the King should be mounted, he is not, atm.

The Rohirrim are mentioned to be tall and strong, so an extra HP and strength across the board are ok. They are, in fact, very similar themewise to EA Ulm, both inspired by norse people, I think.

The morale of the mounted troops is a bit meh across the board, topping at 13 for the scared. What is it that the standard bearer has 11 compared to 12 for the rider? They are to be brave and unbreakable, as you say!

Also, you give an additional +1/+2 attack but not defense? In my understanding Rohan riders are sort of medium cavalry in terms of armor but excellently skilled fighters on their horses. I'd take the knight unit as a base to orient myself statwise and armourwise in the early age ~12. I think 5 encumbrance is arguably high for a rider spending their whole life in the saddle on superior horses. They do not tire, go down to 3 (skirmishers) and 4 for the rest.

I am not sure if they should have sacreds at all. Rather than the royal guard I think a capital only shield maiden unit would fit. The royal guard is just like a rider with better armour and +1 across the board.

Religion is poorly developed, and I think more nature oriented, they are a rural people after all. A female shaman 1H1N0.1WDAS maybe? I have some trouble justifying the priestess or any lvl2 priest, except the king.

Interesting that you saw Rohan as a strict absolute monarchy, I doubt that they have the infrastructure and administration to support one. They are rather a tribal society, somewhere on the verge of a feudal system with a king and its council being important on nation-wide decisions but that the scattered half-nomad communities would be fairly independent in day to day matters.

I like your taking as making the king unique! There should be a way to promote a horseman to king, though, through a spell that can only be cast once there isn't any king left, like the prophet. I doubt that this is moddable though.

The capital gives only 4 gems, I guess it is intentional, although I do not understand why. Ok, this is not a magically rich setting in terms of spellcasters, mainly because magic is almost exclusively corrupted by Sauron, but the land itself is full of magic.

Some suggestions: The hornburg is a mountain refuge, built strong. So it could give 1E income. Also, a cap only castle builder could be argued, something like a helming leader, e1n1, with stronger castle defense. In peace he helps growing crops, constructs tools but his main job is to maintain the defenses.

You could add the hobbit (was it Meriadoc Took?) as a hero. A stealthy, sling throwing armoured hoburg champion with good MR, 2 more HP, slightly better stats (he drank the Ent stuff).

I would mod shadowfax as a riderless horse, there are other cases of intelligent animals in the game, like the boar for Marverni. Mapmove 4, 40AP, high defense, awe, domsummon horse, standard 15, decent MR, leader, sacred? Onebattlespell running, maybe. Reinvig 2, enc 2. Two misc slots, hoof attack only. Maybe a fear causing aura, attack, or spell?

One hero should have the horn, which should add a high standard and enable some panic/fear spell or effect. Not sure if this is moddable as a unique artifact, I'd rather add it as a hero who comes with the effects.

An interesting idea would be to add Wormtongue as a strong heretic (10?) hero adding misfortune but nice magic paths, like F2A2W2D2S2.

Foodstamp, please don't get me wrong this is just my taking on the Rohan theme, meant as constructive criticism, take from it what you like. I know that this is a completely different interpretation of the theme but I wanted to share my thoughts.

[Nikelaos]

having a 10 heretic hero appear in the first few turns would be disasterous, especially if you hav a weak dominon. I think it's far too excessive and could be more of a curse than a blessing. perhaps 3 heretic like LA pythiums revelers, if wormtongue would be implemented.

[fantasma]

Well, that's sort of the point about Wormtongue, isn't it? He IS a curse and somehow should be in the game.

[Gregstrom]

A curse that wipes out a nation if he appears in the first few turns is no fun, though.

Make him a high stealth spy who automatically causes unrest, perhaps?

[Nikelaos]

agreed with the above

[Foodstamp]

Really good ideas, ty for taking the time to post. Fantasma, I like your take on Rohan better than mine .

[fantasma]

Imagine you get him turn 2, it will wipe dominion in your capital, but usually it will have spread somewhere. And heretic ability is only effecting the province the unit is in, no? So, you should conquer something with your starting army turn 2, send him along, thus your capital has time to reestablish dominion. He will probably idle/search for some time until you find a place to stick him in. Or you can just kill him off, he should be physically weak, the archetype of the whimsy human mage, although I definitely would not make him old.

On a second thought, I would start looking at a mixture of horse tribe, eponi knight as a place to start. No hoof attack. 25-30g. You need specially trained warhorses to teach them trampling. This unit is just the average farmer mounted on one of the abundant horses. A shortbow, a light lance, a broadsword. Maybe javelin? Enc 3, fast, high defense, att 11.

Then the rider of Rohan, the more or less standing army, should be a knight with 12 protection-chainmail and the cap.

I don't think there should be other recruit everywhere infantry besides the militia, not the shortbow infantry. Yes, a cheap archer is nice, but they live and die on horseback, except the ones from Helm's Deep.

I think the wise woman is too cheap, but should be sacred, maybe h1. Don't forget, you get so many path combinations with frequent astral, so all paths are easily boosted on the battlefield. That means all powerful ANSD spells are in range without much effort.

I don't know, a sprinkle of water could be justifiable in some place, like earth. I would have to reread the two towers, but the ferocious fighting skill could mean some access to fire, or berserker abilities. Maybe on a mounted sacred warrior maiden. They should be mounted anyways, it's all about horses. But then the warrior maiden stretches the theme. It is a pretty rare appearance, more of a hero, than a recruitable.

[Gregstrom]

Originally Posted by fantasma

Imagine you get him turn 2, it will wipe dominion in your capital, but usually it will have spread somewhere.

Usually. Not always. And of course that depends on your base dominion, whether you have an awake pretender, whether you make a prophet on turn 1 and so on. If I'm forced into making gameplay decisions because of a potentially lethal national hero, that's a bad thing.

Originally Posted by fantasma

So, you should conquer something with your starting army turn 2, send him along, thus your capital has time to reestablish dominion. He will probably idle/search for some time until you find a place to stick him in. Or you can just kill him off,

So you get a hero who sometimes *has* to be left idle or suicided? Where's the fun?

[fantasma]

Well, what is the fun of getting a human commander hero? Yay, a super troop ferry. He has to be idle until you can afford a lab, but usually I'd spend his time site searching, leaving him idle or suicide him is just if you are fearing dominion kill. And that all assumes he appears very very early. To counter this, he should bring significant diversification and/or other interesting options. But he is a serious, potentially lethal danger to the nation, and that should be represented.

He could also be stealthy (he is a sneaker, after all) and a spy, so just send him off to enemy territory. Actually, I like this better than the mage idea. A spy with seduction (by whispers and promises, not sexually).

My approach is primarily thematic, though.

[Gregstrom]

[quote] Well, what is the fun of getting a human commander hero? Yay, a super troop ferry.[quote]

That's why the Worthy Heroes mod exists. Besides which, I don't think it's a good argument to say 'the status quo is less than ideal, so a mod shouldn't worry if it does the same'.

Why not make Wormtongue a corrupter rather than of a seducer? It'd be more thematic, and more useful.