REALLY hard to hit units counter

[thejeff]

I thought they still take a point if they make the def check, blowing their glamour?

Not so useful against equipped Van thugs. But still nice.
If they are being used in large numbers, countering with one Neifel Jarl with trample boots would help drop the glamour. And a bunch of others to actually do damage.

Probably better to just try for area affect attacks.

[jimkehn]

You might try the swarm spell. Low level low cost nature. It is a surprisingly nasty little spell. I use this spell a lot of times in the arena and have brought down powerful pretenders with it.