OOB 22 Question

[Karagin]

Why does this OOB have the M1A1 SA? We never sent any Abrams to Afghanistan, other than a limited run by the Marines, and those were pulled out LONG before the country fell. The unit I am referring to is Unit 657.

Having been in Afghanistan, with tankers who wanted their beloved Abrams, but were told the terrain didn't favor the proper use of the said system, the only tanks I saw while there were Leopards of the Canadians.

Now I know the OOBs are normally well researched, so I am asking if there are any documents that support this inclusion and yes before Don says it, I know I can easily delete it vis MobHack, and in fact already have.

So I am mainly asking the why, and wonder if the logic (or lack of it) of giving the Iraqis M1s that would we would do the same to the Afghani military, and thus it falls into the hands of the Mujahideen/Taliban, etc...flavor of the month name, and all that.

[Mobhack]

Try looking through the MBTs thread - it may be in there?

[Karagin]

Originally Posted by Mobhack

Try looking through the MBTs thread - it may be in there?

Okay thank you.

[DRG]

OOB 22 is Mujahadeen, not Afganastan although it can be used as an insurgent against Afghanistan it is a general catch-all OOB for any and all insurgent forces in that region.

I cannot exactly recall why the M1A1 SA was added but it is likely as a potential capture from the Iraqis since both are named the same way which differs from the one in the US OOB but it was added SEVEN YEARS AGO.... why is this suddenly an "issue" and why assume it has anything to do with Afghanistan?

That OOB could be used for any insurgent force from Morocco to Pakistan

[Karagin]

Originally Posted by DRG

OOB 22 is Mujahadeen, not Afganastan although it can be used as an insurgent against Afghanistan it is a general catch-all OOB for any and all insurgent forces in that region.

I cannot exactly recall why the M1A1 SA was added but it is likely as a potential capture from the Iraqis since both are named the same way which differs from the one in the US OOB but it was added SEVEN YEARS AGO.... why is this suddenly an "issue" and why assume it has anything to do with Afghanistan?

That OOB could be used for any insurgent force from Morocco to Pakistan

See the issue is, I wasn't aware of the generic "take" on this OOB, for me it's the one to use for the Russians to take on, just like the North Vietnam one is for the US. If I want insurgents I use the Red OOB. And having the AI drop a couple of M1s in a battle wasn't what I was expecting.

[Mobhack]

OOB 22 does different things for different opponents - e.g its ISIS against Iraq post Saddam, different Islamist groups vs the French and so on. And ISIS did capture and use some ex-Iraqui MBT.

Afghanistan is for whoever is in (nominal) control of the country, be it the Soviet's puppets, NATO, the Taliban etc. - I think that one has the most flags out of all the other OOBS!

[Karagin]

Originally Posted by Mobhack

OOB 22 does different things for different opponents - e.g its ISIS against Iraq post Saddam, different Islamist groups vs the French and so on. And ISIS did capture and use some ex-Iraqui MBT.

Afghanistan is for whoever is in (nominal) control of the country, be it the Soviet's puppets, NATO, the Taliban etc. - I think that one has the most flags out of all the other OOBS!

A bit late I know, but maybe it having a new flag for the post "Soviet" era or something like that.

Thank you for the info on who they are also doubling as.

[Mobhack]

Search on "muj" in the game guide - as different spellings used for the Mujahadeen.

The main info is in the various game release notes, heres an extract of the broad particulars:

Default, you can select only a terrain type of a limited type, but this is highly not recommended as the Camo Workshop battle location code is designed to generate different battle locations, for example, the USSR versus the Mujadeen between 1979 and 1988 will produce historically appropriate locations, taken from the chronology in Lester W Grau's book 'The Bear Went Over The Mountain',

39/ The Mujahedeen vs Afghan Army will now use Afghanistan battle locations if fighting each other, not Syrian.

40/ Russia vs Mujahedeen from 11/2015 on will now give Syrian batlocs, as Russia vs Syrian rebels or other anti-Syrian groups.

Turkey VS Mujahadeen , battle locations (batlocs) are in Syria post 2013 and Mujahadeen uses ISIL forces. Also Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt, Gulf States, Saudi Arabia (generic Middle East) Israel VS Mujahadeen - generic middle east locations, v ISIL post 2013. Mujahadeen v Mujahadeen post 2011, uses Syrian batlocs, post 2013 uses ISIL troops (Syrian civil war)

Afghanistan battles in winter can now produce snowy maps, especially in mountain maps.

UK specific town battle locations to Afghanistan (Sangin, Musa Quala etc) have been added.

Battles involving Syria and Iraq vs Mujahideen for current dates have had new battle locations put into the game

ISIL / ISIS troops have been added to the Mujahideen OOB. The AI will used these units when Mujahideen is an AI opponent for Syria or Iraq

If Kenyas opponent is Mujahideen the default maps are Northern Kenya or Southern Sudan instead of Afghanistan. Mujahideen here represents Al-Shabab, Al-Quaeda, or Sudanese bandits and local warlords.

France Vs Mujahideen January 2013-Dec 2025 battle location changes. Such battles now occur in Western (sub-Saharan) Africa or the Sahel (Southern Sahara). (Mali and environs). Nigeria now also uses this set of battle locations V Mujahideen, 1946- 2025 for the African force to go to Mali or just as Tuareg and other irregulars.

French expeditionary AI Pick list produced for selection of forces against various enemies that are more infantry-centric. Includes Mujahideen, Viet Cong, Cambodia etc. Expeditionary list is more infantry-centric and tends to use armoured cars rather than tanks. In early days, uses "goumiers" as generic local supporting forces.

[DRG]

It's wiki but it's accurate for the game

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen

.......an Arabic term that broadly refers to people who engage in jihad ......

The widespread use of the word in English began with reference to the guerrilla-type militant groups led by the Islamist Afghan fighters in the Soviet–Afghan War . The term now extends to other jihadist groups in various countries such as Myanmar (Burma), Cyprus, and the Philippines.