What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies

[MarkSheppard]

One of the things that jumped out for me is that the traditional model of mine deployment in Steel Panthers (mines only being able to be bought as the defender in an assault/defend game) may no longer work; due to drone-laid mines making it very easy to deploy mines overnight -- granted, these drone laid mines would be very easy to see -- literally on the road surface(s), but there would be so many of them; achieving the objective of slowing down the enemy as they're forced to stop and begin mine-clearing.

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, that we have to deal with attack drones now, and it is what it is, to possibly have mine laying drones which theoretically you can have untold number of I would believe would change the game's dynamic and the game times being extended.

Baseball a couple of years ago switched to the 30 Second "pitch clock" that has pretty much across the board shorted the game by at least 40 minutes to an hour+ and drove up viewership and improved attendance at the stadiums after slumping in both categories for a few years this was a major plus for the game.

I again would RESPECTFULLY suggest such a move would be like Baseball saying "screw" the fans and who needs television viewership (Which for MLB would equate to a significant loss in profits due to loss in advertising revenue that especially the "poorer" teams rely on from the revenue sharing practices of the MLB.) if they "turned the clock back" so to speak.

It's the best analogy I could come up with "on the fly" in relationship of its significance to that game.

My typical turn count based on our current map size etc. etc. is 25 to 35 turns per game on average over the same number of battles in my typical Campaign.

My buy under such circumstances would be to buy these wonderful drones, mine laying artillery a handful of tanks with some infantry and some SPAA.

My tactics would be to mine the Hell out of the approaches and my flags. My mobile units would be in "safe zones" to respond to any breach or if opportunity allows capture what flags I can AFTER the AI HAS BLOODIED ITSELF or SIMPLY RUN OUT OF TIME.

WE MUST NOT FORGET (2) things about the AI on the ATTACK or MEETING ENGAGEMENT it has one role CAPTURE AND CAPTURE MORE.

I have seen such as a single ATGW team "pop up" and start to capture flags when the AI hardly had a unit left on the map.

When the AI is DEFENDING I've NEVER ONE TIME seen where I've haven't had to clear some fairly or more dense minefields.

It's very SLOW and can be VERY COSTLY and this in OVER 20 YEARS OF PLAYING against the AI.

Been playing this game from its ORIGIN TO ITS PRESENT PRESENTAION and it has always been about TACTICAL MANUVER.

What I feel at this moment is that mine laying drones would put us at a "CROSSROADS" better defined as VERY LOOSLY WWI or more to the point the Ukraine potentially.

I didn't invest all my time and some money to spend half a battle or more to clearing minefields.

Again, that is exactly what's happening in the Ukraine to a large extent.

You're not hearing so much about battles as you are about Drones I.E. this weekend's Drone attack on Kiev.

There is always a Cost and with that there's always a "Cause and Affect" or "Unintended Consequences" that come into play .

And if nothing I posted has any effect on your point of view, take a few moments and look at that Russian map again Mark posted (164) above.

I did and that's why this was posted. My game/RL reaction was OMG what a nightmare that would be.

Was to post this a 3 hours ago however, I never miss CINCLANTHOMEs Pot Roast and a little after dinner chat on my off days!!

Regards,
Pat

[zovs66]

Originally Posted by FASTBOAT TOUGH

WITH ALL DUE RESPECT...
Regards,
Pat

I had to ask ChatGPT to summarize what you are trying to say, the AI said your saying:

The poster is expressing concern that adding mine-laying drones to a wargame would drastically slow down gameplay, much like real-world conflicts (e.g., Ukraine) where mines and drones have made battles more about attrition and slow progress than maneuver warfare. They compare it to Major League Baseball's pitch clock, which shortened games and improved engagement—implying the opposite effect would happen if mine-laying drones were added to the game.

They explain their fear that players (especially the AI) would focus on flooding the map with mines, leading to longer, slower, more tedious games with less tactical flexibility. This could lead to frustration and potentially drive players away from the game.

Their main point: while modern warfare includes drones and mines, bringing that fully into the game could hurt the gameplay experience by shifting it from fast-paced tactical maneuvering to slow, defensive attrition warfare—which they feel would be a bad design decision.

[lansoar]

A good post that highlights the dangers of knee jerk reactions and/or, ideas that seem great on paper...but..... When you have a game that allows the level of detail control like SP, you have to take a critical factor into account, at least this is my opinion based on my time as a developer.

"Players find a way."

a rule or function that might be blasé on surface value can exponentially result in a "gaming the system" situation. Example? empty panzer corps in Eastern front games. War in the Pacific.....using PBY's or subs to "invade" undefended bases....take them and then withdrawal by the same means when your opponent responds. It's maddening....and it is exponentially tied to the level of detail control the player has. I love GG games but a price of them is that GOD level command allows for so much potential abuse.

[MarkSheppard]

https://x.com/Osint613/status/1927750905958371449

BREAKING: Censorship lifted — Israel releases footage of the “Keren Or” laser system intercepting a drone during the war. The system successfully downed dozens of drones throughout the conflict.

There's also footage of the lasers bringing down drones on other twitter xposts.

I've also heard rumors that the Russians have been using lasers as well to deal with Ukrainian UAS attacking Moscow area, etc.

[MarkSheppard]

More details coming out of the testing of Leonidas High Power Microwave (HPM) weapon (aka a radar turned into a bug zapper)

https://www.technologyreview.com/202...itary-defense/

The Army awarded Epirus a $66 million contract in early 2023, topped that up with another $17 million last fall, and is currently deploying a handful of the systems for testing with US troops in the Middle East and the Pacific. (The Army won’t get into specifics on the location of the weapons in the Middle East but published a report of a live-fire test in the Philippines in early May.)

....

Tyler Miller, a senior systems engineer on Epirus’s weaponeering team, told me that they never know exactly which part of the target drone is going to go down first [from a HPM blast], but they’ve reliably seen the microwave signal get in somewhere to overload a circuit. “Based on the geometry and the way the wires are laid out,” he said, one of those wires is going to be the best path in. “Sometimes if we rotate the drone 90 degrees, you have a different motor go down first,” he added.

The team has even tried wrapping target drones in copper tape, which would theoretically provide shielding, only to find that the microwave still finds a way in through moving propeller shafts or antennas that need to remain exposed for the drone to fly.

....

Epirus is also currently working on an even smaller version of the Leonidas that can mount on top of the Army’s Stryker combat vehicles, and it’s testing out attaching a single microwave unit to a small airborne drone, which could work as a highly focused zapper to disable cars, data centers, or single enemy drones.

[DRG]

Thoughts on the Booker

It did exist in the testing phase for about a year and I have lots of room in the USA extention OOB so I was thinking of leaving it in from 4/124-5/125 for "what if"
?

[whdonnelly]

I'd love to play it and see how it stands up compared to some of the other 40 ton options.

[DRG]

There will be a "Booker Platoon" and "Booker Section" 4/ 2024 - 5/2025 in the USA extention OOB which is accessable when clicking on the ALLIES button in the purchace menu.

[FASTBOAT TOUGH]

Am I to "assume" that by having the extended OOBs under the allies that we can't use them to build/or use them for our "core" units in the game?

Just trying to understand how that relationship will work based on what's been posted.

Just "chalk it up" the question to my lack of technical knowledge in game design.

Also I'm sure sometime in the "deep past" this might've been asked but, will a plane or jet coming on the map with a couple of AA missiles attack say, enemy helicopters that might already be on the map it sees?

To "BOOKER" under the conditions you posted-why not (Though now I wish I hadn't ditched my build info-oh well!?! Best I can say was I had it slightly better than BRADLEY in armor except for the latest on in service now.) it might provide some interesting game play.

That'll be a much more realistic situation then is what you can call the South African Army at his time all I can say is "there will be blood" in that OOB. Corruption, incompentance and more. It would be a "Best Selling" novel of fiction if it wasn't for the fact it's a shameful but true story.

Also I found a piece of new equipment that will transcend BOTH games within the last week quite by accident but fully verified none the less.

Regards,
Pat