Space Empires 101 - Galactic Council

[AMF]

Do we really want to get into this again? I'm gonna try and limit my comments right now since I'm in a foul mood and might say something I'd regret. Suffice it to say that I stand by my reasoning, which, by the way, I stated clearly, multiple times, and publicly. Your continued accusations run the chance of spoiling the game overall and have other overtones as well.

Perhaps I made the wrong choice. I already apologized. But I made the choice based on the idea that I did not want to upset the geopolitical/strategic or roleplaying aspects of the game by my leaving. Merging the number two empire with the Last (or nearly Last) place empire who was an ally from the earliest turns of the game and was interspersed with mine seemed a clear way to do it. The result was an unchanged geopolitical situation that was in tune with historical and roleplaying considerations.

The decision to "upset the game" was not made by me, but, instead, by those powers who apparently immediately attacked what my former empire. Oh, and did I mention that those powers are the ost powerful in the game (numbers one and three and on down, IIRC). No problem with such an attack, but to then go on and complain that the entire situation was "unfair" seems more than a bit like sour grapes, no?

Frankly, I was not "tired" of the game, I quite enjoyed the 101 game. As I mentioned many times I NEEDED to quit. Over the past month I have gotten out of 4 of my ten games for the exact same reasons.

Ok, just to go on, cause I'm getting worked up here, since you brought up the host bit, I was not the original host of the game. If you'll remember, the game had effectively died when the former host up and bailed. I took over the reins to keep it going. I have NO idea why the fact that I am host of the game matters one whit for this issue, but you brought it up.

More: you didn;t seem to have a problem with the Dei-O surrendering to the RCC earlier? So, the discussion of "surrender shouldn't be allowed anyways" is a bit disengenous.

The heck with it, I'll keep going, why stop now?

You further intimated that I ceded the RCC to Thermolia becuase perhaps I knew him in real life. At the time I was too p*ssed off to really respond but I can do so now. I do NOT know this thermolian character. I have NEVER cheated in a game (which is what you're implying) - EVER - and the intimation that I have is, frankly, reprehensible. Of course, I have no way of proving that, but neither do I feel a need to (I've already laid out my reasoning for what I did many times, and I stand by it - while admitting that I might have done it better)

In fact, let me apologize again for the manner in which I made the decision and the way in which I implemented it. Clearly I could have done those parts better. But, neither will I repudiate what I did becuase I think it was in keeping with the strategic, geogrpahical, historical, and roleplaying aspects of the game. I did not want to quit the game, and in retrospect, I should have let the AI or another player take it over. Had I done so, I'm pretty convinced that RCC would have still been attacked by Cyber et al, but whatever.

So, go ahead and yell "poor playmanship" if you feel you must, but I think it's pretty clearly sour grapes and not based on an objective assessment of my reasoning. Yes, I should have let the AI take over and for that I apologize. But just the same, I am pretty insulted by the accusation.

Toodle-oo.

EDIT: I should probabably have posted that in a private message, my apologies for cluttering up the forum for everyone else. BUT, I wanted to giver everyone the option to spout off about my actions if they felt like it. If I well and truly did p*ss everyone off, I'd prefer to hear about it not so I can avoid it in the future.

Originally posted by Wardad:
OOC:
This whole Empire Gift affair is an example of poor playmanship.

Some hosts say that surrender should go to the empire that does the most damage. Other hosts don't allow surrender and require turning the empire over to the AI. Still there are others that allow surrender. It is a matter of the house rules, and this game had no surrender rules.

BUT... The wholesale gifting of a major and playable empire is simply over the top. Especially when a large part of that empire was taken in surrender, due to a coalition action.
And especially when the gift giver is the host, and tired of the game.
Why could he not do the normal thing, turn it over to the AI and find a replacement player?


IC:
The Thermolian Empire will be punished for accepting the gift. RCC will be punished by having their former empire torn apart.
Standby and continue in peace.
Join the effort and share the spoils.

[ July 27, 2004, 17:50: Message edited by: alarikf ]

[Chris Blagdon]

I think this Councils been a fantastic bit of role play. This is similar to how medi evil kings were. In thos days, as in the game, possesion is nine tenths of the law. Very often if you wanted rid of a noble you granted huge tracts of land to them the sit back and watch the envy of other nobles go to work in the ensuing bunfight.

There are more ways than just combat to win a game. The territory gift to themolians may well prove to be another Version of the trojan horse. This gift has altered the play balance but so the did the japanese when they bombed pearl harbour. It brought the Americans in to the war and so tipped the scales. This is life my friends. And we can always have a good punch up to solve any disagreements :-)))))

I'm really enjoying this game it has had sooo many twists and turns.
Thankyou everyone.

Meanwhile back at HQ.........

[AMF]

Tis the old theorem in international relations about dealing with capabilities versus intentions.

Much of realpolitik is based upon preparations to go to war against those powers who are most capable, rather than only against those who are your enemies.

Intentions can change overnight, capabilities change slowly.

Hence, the world can change suddenly in times of revolution. Look at the shock the European allies recevied when suddenly the Russians underwent a bolshevik revolution in 1917. Overnight, the relatively great capabilities of the Russians went from being a friend to being a foe.

There are many examples of this in human history...

Originally posted by Chris Blagdon:
I think this Councils been a fantastic bit of role play. This is similar to how medi evil kings were. In thos days, as in the game, possesion is nine tenths of the law. Very often if you wanted rid of a noble you granted huge tracts of land to them the sit back and watch the envy of other nobles go to work in the ensuing bunfight.

There are more ways than just combat to win a game. The territory gift to themolians may well prove to be another Version of the trojan horse. This gift has altered the play balance but so the did the japanese when they bombed pearl harbour. It brought the Americans in to the war and so tipped the scales. This is life my friends. And we can always have a good punch up to solve any disagreements :-)))))

I'm really enjoying this game it has had sooo many twists and turns.
Thankyou everyone.

Meanwhile back at HQ.........

[trooper]

Oficial communication of the leader of the Citizen Federation :

We, of the Citizen Fed have full respect for our long Lasting ally, the Cyber Collective, who helped us to free the galaxy of the Dei/Electrum axis of evil.

That's why we have decided to support them with all our military forces, and asked to all our allies to do so, unless they want to stay neutral in this affair.

Moreover, we have always been wary of fanatic religious undeads, and we strongly believe that so much power into such odd people's hands is a danger for the galaxy. RCC, who were good friends until now has proven to be very unwise and will assume the consequences of their decision to put their great empire into these hands.

Sky Marechal Brunwick
Citizen Federation

--- End of communication ---

[trooper]

Oficial communication of the leader of the Citizen Federation :

With the surrender of Thermolian empire, a new era has risen for the Citizen federation.

First, I will not be ungrateful and I'll give several systems to those who helped us in this war and other previous events.

Due to an extremely violent civil disorders and uncontrolled RCC ships rampaging in our new systems, the martial law has been declared in the whole federation. That's why I ask all the empire leaders to keep their vessel away from my systems, unless they have a planet in the vicinity.

Sky Marechal Brunwick
Citizen Federation

[Thermodyne]

IC: So that the numerous races that make up Thermolia may be spared the pain and agony of another conflict, the Thermolian leadership has this day surrendered our forces and cedes jurisdiction of our holdings. We have ordered all Fleet and Marine units to stand down and make themselves available to the new government. We lament that elements among our people have taken issue with this decision. There are reports that some fleet units scuttled their commands rather than surrender and we have reports that there have been many acts of sabotage against industrial amenities. There are also reports that the priests have packed up the bulk of our religious icons and set off for an unknown location somewhere in deep space. Denying the people the benefit of these shrines during this period of instability.

OOC: No need to put off the inevitable. Against one, I could have made the cost of victory high. Against two, it would have been a long tortuous string of defeats. As to who got the leavings, the first one to declare war was given the bootie. Now the rest of you guys will have to reappraise your situations.

[AMF]

Allllrriighty then. So, is Thermolia *dead* or *open for a player*?

I'd like to mark them dead if they're dead, obviously, so I don't get someone joining up as them (like that poor guy who joined up as the Dog Warriors, who were apparently dead as doornails...)

thanks,
Alarik

[trooper]

Definitively dead. Snig.

[Thermodyne]

Originally posted by alarikf:
Allllrriighty then. So, is Thermolia *dead* or *open for a player*?

I'd like to mark them dead if they're dead, obviously, so I don't get someone joining up as them (like that poor guy who joined up as the Dog Warriors, who were apparently dead as doornails...)

thanks,
Alarik

It's dead, wipe it out.

[Chris Blagdon]

King Maximal formaly proposes that the Citizen Empire has won this game and is the new overlord of this Galaxy. If any-one disputes this let them come forward.

None of us can stand against his might.

If everyone accepts this then we can, for fun, see how long we can Last if we all went against him. But first we have to acknowledge Citizens victory.

King Maximal ll