TDM-ModPack 2.00 BETA - Page 12

capnq · #**111** November 15th, 2001, 03:22 AM

Aquilaeian_AI_General.txt has a typo:

Race Opt 2 Num Characteristics should be 11. The 4th and 5th characteristic are both numbered 4, so the 5th thru 11th should be renumbered.

At some point, the Ork .emp files changed name formats; if you used the beta updates, you have duplicate files named "Ork_2000" and "Ork 2000", etc.

quote:
As most people already know, there is a bug/feature which cause problems with random race picking: SEIV does not allow a race to have several advanced traits with combined points exceeding the race set-up limit, even if you make up deficit buy reducing race traits.

I'm not certain this is an accurate description of the "bug". It was stated in another thread that the random empires are chosen from the .emp folder; it appears the race settings from AI_General files aren't used there. It isn't clear to me where the race options are used; the Quick Start page looks at the AI_General files, but Quick Start is always a 2000 point game. Race Options 2 and 3 are never called by the software, AFAICT.

I went through and checked all the .emp files via Add Existing to a 5000 point start. Every ModPack race spent exactly as many points as labelled; all the original races that haven't been modified for the ModPack only have 2000 point Versions.

------------------
Cap'n Q
My first SE IV mod! Hypermaze quadrant
The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the
human mind to correlate all of its contents. We live on a placid
island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was
not meant that we should go far. -- HP Lovecraft, "The Call of Cthulhu"

[This message has been edited by capnq (edited 15 November 2001).]

geoschmo · #**112** November 15th, 2001, 05:21 AM

quote:
Stated by OlegAs most people already know, there is a bug/feature which cause problems with random race picking: SEIV does not allow a race to have several advanced traits with combined points exceeding the race set-up limit, even if you make up deficit buy reducing race traits.

quote:
Stated by CapnqI'm not certain this is an accurate description of the "bug". It was stated in another thread that the random empires are chosen from the .emp folder; it appears the race settings from AI_General files aren't used there. It isn't clear to me where the race options are used; the Quick Start page looks at the AI_General files, but Quick Start is always a 2000 point game. Race Options 2 and 3 are never called by the software, AFAICT.

Actually I believe Oleg stated the bug pretty well, but I believe it's bug that was fixed in 1.41. Is it back? I haven't played with ai's in a while.

Random placed empires do not use the .emp files. I know that for a fact. Regardless of whether it's a standard or quick start game. They do use the ai_general files. The only use of .emp files is if you specifically place them in the players screen at game startup.

Geoschmo

Deathstalker · #**113** November 15th, 2001, 05:39 AM

Tried to post this yesterday but the forum would not let me on.

Anyway. I am playing with the Beta Update Version 3 of the new TDM Modpack, Medium Tech start and the Terran race is still using APB II at turn 57. I assume this is due to the 'med tech start' as you start off with APB II's there.

Just thought I'd let you know. (they still hold the #1 spot in the game besides this, with my Y'Gath AI firmly in 2nd.)

------------------
"We are all...the sum of our scars"....(paraphrased) Matt. R. Stover-'Blade of Tyshalle'.

"Human existance is all imagination...Reality is no more than a simple agreement among its participants that this is where we shall meet, and these are the rules that we shall abide by."- Kevin McCarthy/David Silva "The Family:Special Effects"..

"Long Live the Legion!!"-Comic book fandom...

Vildecor · #**114** November 15th, 2001, 07:03 AM

An interesting problem I've come across:

A "Range Error" will occur after using the combat simulator when playing with the Sergetti. It doesn't matter which ships you use. It does not happen when simulating Sergetti ships as another race.

Vildecor

Alpha Kodiak · #**115** November 15th, 2001, 04:27 PM

I have posted updated Versions of the Rage and Vaxin in the Mod forum. They address some of the issues that came up in the test games. Let me know what you think!

Master Belisarius · #**116** November 15th, 2001, 05:16 PM

Goeschmo: the patch 1.41 not fixed all the problems with the random AI generator. Take a look and you will see.

Capnq: Thanks for the report about the typo in the Aquilaeian_AI_General.txt!!

Rollo: I forget to test "maximum ship size from start� with simultaneous movement� But I�ll do it!

Oleg: thanks for the suggestion and can understand your view, ok?
But I will keep the original general.txt like the save files for three reasons:
1) I hope that MM will fix it some day.
2) Although the race will be a bit more strong because will use 1000 extra points, still will be more weak than the *.emp race.
3) With the current bug, I think that if somebody want to play against a challenging race, most the time is forced use the *.emp files. Then, if somebody want to play with random races, should use 5000 points for the AIs or assume that will play against more weak races.

geoschmo · #**117** November 15th, 2001, 06:08 PM

MB, I see what's happening. It used to not decrease characteristics that you had set below 100% in the general text file. It appears he has that part working, but it won't use the extra points in selecting the other attributes. This has been reported to Aaron that it is still not working right?

Geoschmo

Alpha Kodiak · #**118** November 15th, 2001, 06:12 PM

For a more in depth discussion of the problem with the AI_General file and randon generation, see this thread:
http://www.shrapnelgames.com/ubb/For...ML/004084.html

Mephisto · #**119** November 15th, 2001, 06:55 PM

Racial Points Bug:
This one has been reported and will be taken care of in the next SE4 Patch.

To Deathstalker: Yes, you are correct. I noticed this behaviour myself when I set up a medium Tech game in the past. But unfortunately there is really no way around it, so.

To Vildecor: I tried to reproduce the bug but it worked fine for me. Might be a problem on your PC. Anyway, thanks that you reported it, that's the only way we can be sure it is not a general problem.

Deathstalker · #**120** November 15th, 2001, 07:13 PM

Q"To Deathstalker: Yes, you are correct. I noticed this behaviour myself when I set up a medium Tech game in the past. But unfortunately there is really no way around it, so. "

The only way around this I can see is by making a seperate attack/defense ship that has ABP's and has a line in the 'must have' for a component that is discovered around the same time as the APB's. This way the normal attack/defense ship can not have the APB's listed in it's weapon types. Maybe using the 'scanner jammer' as a must have?? (did'nt look close enough to see if it is developed around the same time.) Or maybe limit it by ship size (ie, if APB's and BattleCruisers are developed around the same time then have APB's added only after BC's are discovered).

Just some ideas....

------------------
"We are all...the sum of our scars"....(paraphrased) Matt. R. Stover-'Blade of Tyshalle'.

"Human existance is all imagination...Reality is no more than a simple agreement among its participants that this is where we shall meet, and these are the rules that we shall abide by."- Kevin McCarthy/David Silva "The Family:Special Effects"..

"Long Live the Legion!!"-Comic book fandom...