Why no Save game Feature

[Gandalf Parker]

Here is the version that I use:
right-click on the Dom3 icon
go to properties
at the end of the target line (after the quotes if there are any) add --preexec pre.bat --postexec post.bat

then go to the Dom3 directory and right-click into the files list and choose "New->text file".

type in
xcopy /yes savedgames oldsaves /i

then save it as pre.bat
It will copy all of the games to a backup everytime that the game hosts any of the games.

Actually I have many more lines in my pre.bat file and many more in my post.bat file. They do file checks, record the date/time so I can get an idea of how long processing takes, checks my alarm file and shuts down the game at important times like when I need to get my kid off the bus, it talks, all kinds of stuff. Im debating having it load a key file to add some new keystrokes to the game but I probably shouldnt since I would forget which are standard keys and Id give wrong answers here.

[Actuarian]

Gandalf,

I've only used saves for trying to understand game mehanics and spell effect, but those are the keystrokes I used. I was too lazy to create a batch program.

Still I bet that most Windows games that have an in-game backup mechanism can also be backed up by those same commands.

[alexti]

Saxon said:
I may have missed this, there are a lot of things in Dom. How do I set it for auto save each turn?

There are many ways. I'm using rather sophisticated one. I'd attach it here if I could figure out how to do it Since I can't I'll make separate post:
http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...vc=#Post486865

Since you've posted Gandalf has already explained how auto-saves work in Dom3, so I won't repeat it.

[alexti]

Actuarian said:
Still I bet that most Windows games that have an in-game backup mechanism can also be backed up by those same commands.

Right, I'm simply adjusting my scripts for each particular game. So far I've got a total of 2 games on Windows with in-game backup mechanism: Dominions 2 and Dominions 3

[alexti]

Velusion said:
So let me get this strait:

1) It's really easy to back up files. You could create a simple batch file to do it and it would be easy to whip up a mod that would do it as well.

2) It's too complex for the designers to patch it into the game.

????? That line of reasoning doesn't make much sense.

If you carefully look at why it's easy to back up files it will start to make sense. The simplest approach (at least in the eyes of Windows users) would use windows explorer. Windows explorer (and it's GUI in particular) is not that trivial and coding something similar (especially in a portable way) is a considerable effort. Other methods may use other tools (such as zip, awk, perl etc...). Once again recoding their functionality, or at least integrating with it (if it's available under LGPL) is a significant effort. Easiest approach is probably to provide some script similar to ones posted on this forum, but that would mean taking care of all installation issues to ensure that the correct version of correct package is installed on the target computer. So all together it's one major headache.

And besides, reinventing the wheel probably goes against developer's principles

[Ubik]

Gandalf Parker said:
[...]
Or you could always just say "old married man".

LOL!!!! Spot On!

[HoneyBadger]

I think this is probably the best solution-not a good solution, but the best for the circumstances-that, rather than implore the Devs to shoehorn a feature they don't find appealing in, we take it upon ourselves to find a solution that might not be the best polished little ivory button in Computerland, but gives the people some of what they want, and shows favorably on our little community as being helpful and responsive-which isn't a bad thing all around. If that doesn't satisfy everyone, then atleast we've done everything in our power to lend a helping hand.

[Newthought]

Gandalf:
Actually I can't create my own Save System. You can call me pathetic, this specific area is just not my expertise.

Badger:
After reviewing what you said, honestly, albiet may be 2 late, didn't wish to put implications of vigiliance. Honestly, I have a perfectly controlled sense of emotion but coupled with an inability to understand others without facial expressions, any conclusion can come from within my words, for they tend to be very Oblivious from page to page.

Futhermore, I am not a Bibilical Nut, just Catholic, there is a Difference, look it up.
And a....the Tyranny part was simply Rhetoric just to keep the people off my back for having a Dissenting opinion

Anyway, pressing for a solution that I percieve the "community" might want (even though I am seperate from this community) I am reluctant to give one. But nevertheless you asked (to no harmful intention)

The problem with making a solution that SP/MP are totally not the same thing, hence I could give an SP solution easily, but an MP solution is hellva lot more tricky.

The Whole Idea is how I want to be able to Test the Waters of my actions and the whole idea of what you want is not to leave from the game as the Developer's intended, at least that is what I percieve.

A solution could be a "in-game feature" known as "Wisdom", only avalible to High Level Astral Mages where you pay a huge sum amount of money+Astral Gems to be able to simuliate one battle of your choice, and it would tell you who the victor is for that simulation only, meaning it would not tell you the extent nor would it tell you the "Real" battle, in luie with mythology, Heroes could only defy the fates for so long.

The Payment scales Horrondesly and no Wizard (Pretender) can do it more then Twice and it has a chance of killing the Wizard (Pretender) outright and it has a chance of giving the Reverse Outcome.

I don't want to shoot my own idea down but I feel like it's one of those Features, high-maintance and incredibly cool and might be impossible, but I'm not sure because these guys are good at programming from what I've seen.

From the Chinese, to the Greeks, to the peoples of the Triple Alliance (Tenochitlian, Tetzcoco, Tlacopan) this thing would be totally awesome, considering that ANY true mythology devulged diviniation as that of the highest priortity. Tenochitilan and Rome were built purely by Oracles and I'm sure almost any event would come in mind 2.

[censored], even Christianity was adopted in Rome when "God" came from the heavens to ensure victory for Constantine by painting the Holy Cross on the Legonary Shield.

That's an idea.

Many things could go wrong with this solution, but in reality, the Oracles pretty much dictated every war including REAL war like the Greeks and Persians. You cannot go anywhere without the "real" Pretender Gods making sure that they are "going to win".

The best part of the Idea is of cours, that you bring yourself ever more closer to "Real Mythology".

Another solution would be to allow a Save Game feature choice to those who want it in SP. (Have to throw it in there)

A Third Solution is where you can pay to Save your Game in SP(Have to throw in there)

So yes, the Oracle idea in summary would look like this,

To do Wisdom.
-High Level Astral Mage
-Requires Astral Gems and Lots of Gold
-The Cost Scales

Results
-Being able to simulate one battle and know who the winner is. No other details revealed

Alternative Outcomes
-Oracle gives unsure answer (meaning no conclusion. "It will be a very big battle)
-Oracle gives the wrong answer (Regardless of what the true outcome is.)
-Oracle dies. (Death from Vision or Drowns in the well water, pick your poision )

Further Constrictions
-Cannot be spammed by the same High level Caster
-The Level requirement also goes up as well.

That's an idea that I think something in which you could like...

This is one of those kinds of requests were only a game like this could pull off succesfully, truthfully.

[Maltrease]

Newthough,

I find the idea of a spell that simulates battles incredibly interesting! This is really almost a completely seperate issue from the save game... but what a neat idea!

I'd say the battle would be completely visible (as if it was real).

Probably mid level astral spell. Maybe astral 5, 20 gems. Pick two provences. Spell plays out battle from army in provence 1 attacking army in provence 2.

I'm not sure of the difficulty in implementing it. It possible that it could be fairly attainable... if they can simply que up a battle as normal but not "save" any of the results.

What a cool spell that would be. Simulating a possible reality.

[HoneyBadger]

Newthought, I wasn't trying to accuse you of being a "biblical nut", quite the contrary, I was just accusing you of using the power of religion to your own purposes-done often enough by politicians who are more in tune with peoples' worst fears than they are with their best hopes.

If anyone's a "bible nut" it's me, I study-well, what I term "Christian occultism" as in the Nephilim and Antedeluvian/deluvian myths and I actually read the Bible a long time ago. I read Genesis several times through-it's quite good.

I equate the Bible with the Lord of the Rings-rather stupifyingly dull if you try to read the whole thing through in one sitting, and not concerning itself with "historical facts" but a logical mythos full of the most fascinating and tantalizing subjects and hints of subjects-and it's easy enough to want it to be real.

Both were also obviously written in the world we all share and both are full of rich and detailed history, as well as visions of other places, times, and people powerful enough to capture our deepest yearning.

Again, worst fears and best hopes, but then that's how to grab hold of people.

Anyway, let's forget about it and move on.

It is indeed quite a good idea. I think such a thing should let you see maybe 5 rounds of a given battle per astral path level of the mage in question. A 15th level mage could then view all 75 rounds of a large battle.

I think it would be difficult to program in though, but Space Empires IV is famous for it's battle-simulator tool, so such a thing is not beyond the reach of a small development team.

Along the saved game lines, perhaps certain games with "victory points" could allow a game to be saved whenever a certain amount of points are reached, and then increase the "cost" to save the game, to a higher amount of points.

In a 25 point game, you could save when you capture 5 points, when your opponent captures 8, when somebody else captures 13, when the first player captures 21, and victory at 25.

This would be a specific breed of game, which would appeal to certain groups of players that are perhaps large, but can only meet maybe once a week or so, and want to replay important turning points in the game.

I am not really against giving the Hosts of (especially, large) MP games the ability to save games. This could in the right hands be an important tool for role-playing, kind of like giving the Host DM/GM powers. It could also ease the upset that can be caused by real-world events-if someone dynamically involved in the game is forced to leave, why not restart the game at an earlier point before that person left suddenly in order to smooth things over?

Save games do have a place in computer games, that's why so many people are asking for them. I'm for keeping them in that place though, and rather than making it a choice whether to save or not save a given game, by making it so easy to do-instead making it a choice whether or not a given player wants to make that function available to themselves, and a part of their game.

I think there should be a way for someone to download that option, if they want it, but it's no more valid an option than a mod. Maybe the Devs could charge a few bucks for it, and make a little added money on the side? That way we who don't want it-or atleast don't want it casually-in our games, have a good solid excuse not to obtain it?