I suck with Pythium ... please help!

[Boron]

Zen said:
With that in mind, I'm not going to weigh in on False Horrors or Caelum. Because certain Dom2 players are like blind men, you are trying to explain what the color the sky is. You can talk all day, but in the end they can't see it and they believe what they want to believe.

Well please post your opinions . I will perhaps ask a lot of questions then about your viewpoints but in the end you probably convince me .

[Boron]

Tuna said:
Ulm, Flying shards/ summon earthpower, hold hold, blade wind. Blade wind up close is very likely to kill every fh that gets in your way.

Bladewind has 80 fatigue . So a mastersmith can cast it twice and after this he is unconscious for some rounds .
He even can damage own troops with the bladewind .

[Cainehill]

Boron said:

Well please post your opinions . I will perhaps ask a lot of questions then about your viewpoints but in the end you probably convince me .

Really? No one's convinced you of anything yet.

---

A mind like a steel trap - rusted shut.

[Thufir]

Cainehill said:
Really? No one's convinced you of anything yet.

Not true! Boron has started using punctuation now!

[Cainehill]

Boron said:

Bladewind has 80 fatigue . So a mastersmith can cast it twice and after this he is unconscious for some rounds .
He even can damage own troops with the bladewind .

Do you ever try playing something before giving your 'expert' opinion?

First - bladewind tends to do very minimal damage to Ulm's national troops. (Never mind that almost _ANY_ area of effect spell can damage friendly troops, exceptions being cold spells with Jotunheim/Caelum, Fire with Abysia, and poison with undead nations.)

Second - Ulm forges things _cheap_. Mastersmiths that aren't forging / researching / casting are usually going to have earth boots. With Summon Earthpower, Bladewind then costs 40 (plus encumbrance). Three casts, and very quickly a 4th, because of fatigue recovery every turn.

Last, did you notice that he scripted Bladewind for the fifth spell? IE, it's probably going to nail all the gathered false horrors in a group. And could actually probably cast it as the 4th and 5th spells actually, since he'll still be conscious after 2 bladewinds.

[Truper]

I dunno why this thread has degenerated into insults and rudeness, but its sure saddening to see

[Soapyfrog]

Seems to me that its pretty unlikely false horror spam is balanced well or even working as intended. Just as I think clamming and fetishing are out of whack, or that wrathful skies is too easy to research and too easy to cast.

I mean, its a HUGE game... broad AND deep. Odds are it has some outstanding balance issues, and I think that this forum will tend to hit on them since we have a broad mix of players trying all kinds of different things out. I don't think saying "the game is fine, you just suck" is really the answer here.

I don't see any widely available, viable counters to false horrors. Blade wind is tough to get for most people. Fire darts are wildly inaccurate. And of course MOST empires will be damaging their own troops since the false horros fly in all weather conditions. So what else? Berserkers? Again, not exactly widely available.

It doesnt seem to be that simple a problem to solve...

[Huzurdaddi]

I dunno why this thread has degenerated into insults and rudeness, but its sure saddening to see

It started out as a 5 star thread. I was so happy to see people liking my little thread about Pythium. I may start another one after this game I am playing to share with people what little I have learnt and to get more info from other players as to what works.

As to false horrors. I find it weird that the spell breaks indeps so well ( I mean, try it it take 10 minutes to set up a game and get to the stage where you can try it ). With a handfull of Serphas you can take any indep. You can grow at an amazing rate. It SEEMS to me to be faster than any other nation. And it is also great for busting PD.

I think Caelum does not win most games since this strategy takes TIME to develop ( like turn 12 or so on normal research maybe a little earlier ) and on a somewhat small map with a few players conflict happens before this time. However on a big map with a good amount of space my money is on Caelum. It's not 100% alliances can be made stuff like that.

How about this. Take a decent sized map ( something a little bigger than Aran ) with 2 players one takes Caelum one takes something else. Set indpes to let's say 9. My money is on Caelum.

[Cohen]

Caelum doesn't need False Horrors to start indep conquest.
Wind Guide is sufficient with some quicknessed lightning throwers.
In game tested.

I'm happy to see someone thinks that Wrathful Skies is easy to research and cast (want to see Astral Tempest, or the fire counterpart, how much they cost in paths and research level?)

[Boron]

Cainehill said:

Do you ever try playing something before giving your 'expert' opinion?

First - bladewind tends to do very minimal damage to Ulm's national troops. (Never mind that almost _ANY_ area of effect spell can damage friendly troops, exceptions being cold spells with Jotunheim/Caelum, Fire with Abysia, and poison with undead nations.)

Second - Ulm forges things _cheap_. Mastersmiths that aren't forging / researching / casting are usually going to have earth boots. With Summon Earthpower, Bladewind then costs 40 (plus encumbrance). Three casts, and very quickly a 4th, because of fatigue recovery every turn.

Last, did you notice that he scripted Bladewind for the fifth spell? IE, it's probably going to nail all the gathered false horrors in a group. And could actually probably cast it as the 4th and 5th spells actually, since he'll still be conscious after 2 bladewinds.

First ulmish archers , sappers and arlabests can be easy damaged by bladewind .
And more important when casting it on turn 4 or 5 the odds are not bad that the horrors have already routed your troops .
Even if they are not routed it doesn't matter at all since the Seraphs continue spamming false horrors with a few occasional phantasmal warriors .
So very nice , even investing 10 earthgems in earthboots you probably still lose .