*** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***

[jimbob]

Sir Kwok,

Awww, that would be too bad . I guess I just assumed that ST would be merged with the Sci-Fi Cross Over...I personally think the X-over mod would realize only the shadow of it's potential without ST:TNG races and ships. The thought of a Romulan Bird of Prey decloaking off the starboard bow of a Minbari cruiser, or a Dominion fighter chasing down a tie fighter is ... well, I was really looking forward to it! Finally the answer to the eternal question, can the Enterprise (Galaxy Class) take on a Star Destroyer with it's full complement of fighters.

It is still my hope that it will be possible to merge them one day. The technologies in this mod are divergent/unique, and would make for interesting variations in the Sci-Fi Cross Over.

Cheers,

[Captain Kwok]

The TNG Mod is/has a unique tech tree, numbering/picture system, cultural traits and things of that nature that do not follow any systems established by the Sci-Fi Mod. It is intended to be a stand-alone Mod.

Once the TNG Mod is complete - the makers of the Sci-Fi crossover mod are welcome to use parts of the TNG Mod and convert them for use in their Mod. However, I do not have the time to do that so it will be up to someone else.

[Suicide Junkie]

Argh. My post got eaten by the Microsoft demons.
It was a biggie, too.

To summarize,

Tesco: Seems our ideas are totally different. I've replied with mine, hopefully it will be understandable. See what you think.

Minor question:
in the Email, you replaced the cloaking type "temporal" with "subspace". Is that possible and does it work in SE4?

Major Questions for this Discussion thread:

1) Should the Feds get cloaking tech?
- All that was stopping them in the show was morals & a treaty. There may have been covert work going on by section 31.
- If we want the mod to stick to the shows, the player may need to be forcefully encouraged to not use cloaking by not having the tech available.

2) Do all the cloaking devices have to have the same abilities?

I have some ideas for cloaking which will have some side effects on the AI's use of the components, but I believe they will be minor, and that they will improve multiplayer a lot.

[TerranC]

1) Should the Feds get cloaking tech?

Section 31 couldn't have, wouldn't have, shouldn't have a cloaking device in their posession.

*If they do, please give me a whack, as I didn't catch most of DS9 until the war started.*

The U.S.S. Pegasus did have a phase cloak, and it was a testbed for technologies to be used in the Galaxy Class ships, and the original U.S.S. Enterprise captured a romulan cloaking device, so yes, they should have cloak.

It should up to the player whether to use it or not to use it.

2) Do all the cloaking devices have to have the same abilities?

All should defeat Active and Passive, if included in the Mod.

Gravimetric and Temporal should be able to detect cloaked ships and others with ease, but should be VERY EXPENSIVE to research.

[ June 25, 2002, 23:22: Message edited by: TerranC ]

[Suicide Junkie]

All should defeat Active and Passive, if included in the Mod.

Gravimetric and Temporal should be able to detect cloaked ships and others with ease, but should be VERY EXPENSIVE to research.

Note that we don't have to use the same categories as SE4 does. They could just as easily be "Generic", "Klingon", "Romulan", "Federation", and "Other". All you'd need to change is the descriptions.
Heck, you don't even need ability descriptions, and can just not add it to the point form ability list at all. Just describe the overall component as "Sees through cloaks, better at this or that, blah, blah, blah."

My idea for the cloaking involves races building up tech in generic scanners, and with the capture/analysis of a cloaking device, develop a scanner with strength in the appropriate non-generic scan type. ("Klingon", "Romulan", etc)
Thus, if one of your cloaked ships get captured, the rest of your ships with the same cloak might be compromised, and need a retrofit to a newer cloak.

[ June 26, 2002, 02:55: Message edited by: Suicide Junkie ]

[Captain Kwok]

In regards to cloaking and sensors:

I believe that all races should be able to research cloaking to a certain degree. As it stands now, Klingons and Romulans would have access to a few additional levels of cloak.

After viewing some of SJ's suggestions - I'm not sure about a few items. First of all, I don't believe that cloak-detecting sensors should require cloak technology. For example, several races (Feds/Dominion) at times seem adept at detecting cloaks but themselves do not have the same level of technology to use them. Furthermore if all races were to have access to cloaking, this method could potentially result in many, many redundant entires in comps.txt which for the purpose of the lone feature of comprimising another races cloak tech may not be worth it.

I rather focus on creating a variety of different sensors that can detect cloaks at varying levels instead.

However, I would like to implement SJ's cloaking ideas in some capacity. I was thinking the advanced Klingon/Romulan cloaks would require different types of sensors needed to detect them would be tied into cloak technology at some point.

[Captain Kwok]

SJ:

Send me a couple examples of your cloak and scanner and I'll look over this evening. I'll drop by the chat around 5:30 EST today when I get home from work.

[jimbob]

First of all, I don't believe that cloak-detecting sensors should require cloak technology. For example, several races (Feds/Dominion) at times seem adept at detecting cloaks but themselves do not have the same level of technology to use them

It seems to me that the Feds sensors were huge sensor arrays... and that their ability to detect cloaked ships was not founded in their ability to do the cloaking illusion, but that it was in their ability to construct giant sensitive arrays that could detect minor imperfections in their enemy's cloaking devices.

Though this may have been suggested a million times already, what about making separate tech branchs for detection versus cloaking. I'd suggest making the detection devices really large (~450 kT), and allow them to be placed on bases only (versus on ships which could potentially result in large sensor arrays flying around the universe, engaging in combat... )

Hope this is of use.

[tesco samoa]

SJ I replied to your email... with my reasons....

[Captain Kwok]

Though this may have been suggested a million times already, what about making separate tech branchs for detection versus cloaking.

That is how it is currently and I would like to keep that way. I do like the much larger sizes needed for the detection sensors but not quite that big...maybe around 100kT-150kT.

I made a mini update to the tech list at the TNG Mod site, it has some weapons added plus a few of the ideas I've recieved in the Last week.

I'm planning on adding some temporal tech that is not race specific as well for the next list update.