Conceptual Balance (Discussion) - Page 16

HoneyBadger · #**151** April 18th, 2007, 12:46 AM

My pleasure, Drakaina

Managarm · #**152** April 26th, 2007, 02:50 PM

Back to the original thread again...

I'm currently playing SP games with the Conceptual Balance Mod on, and I found that an early "Wild Hunt" is somewhat broken...

Wild Hunt in the original game design is a Conjuration 9 spell, requiring 50 gems and N6. With the CB enabled, this spell gets a huge discount on price/requirements: it becomes a Conjuration 5 spell requiring just 30 gems and N5.

In my SP games, once I got this spell up, I had around 4-6 special battles per turn with a high enemy priest/prophet/sacred commander killing ratio.
That means 2-3 successful 'holy' assassinations per turn at a bargain price of 30 gems!! That's what I call efficiency...

I know that in MP an enemy human player won't be fool enough to keep sending sacreds/priests into the deadly forests each turn; although it can be really annoying for them, specially for the players relying on a hardcore bless strategy (Mictlan)...
Overall I suppose that is a good MP spell for making new friends!

Should this spell cost and requirements be slightly higher than CB but lower than the ones found in the original game?

Thanks

Manuk · #**153** April 26th, 2007, 05:41 PM

yep i did cast wild hunt cb mod in a blitz game. That was too good. Some nations have their best mages also priests.

quantum_mechani · #**154** April 26th, 2007, 05:53 PM

I don't think there are too many cases in MP where angering all the other players are worth however much it would harm them. However, it was 40 gems in dom2 CB, and I wouldn't be opposed to resting it to that.

Xietor · #**155** April 26th, 2007, 06:24 PM

Could not read whole thread, i read the few few pages.

1. MA Ulm, nothing about Ulm warrants the curse of their units and commanders having 9 mr. This defect was remedied, in Aarlens, black steel Ulm mod, which i think made them more viable.

2. MA Pangaea's Pans are good, no old age, but Pangaea is severely limited on research with only a 350 gold mage for 8 research. The limited access to magical paths, combined with expensive research, a 30 admin, castle,and paying a penalty to get mercenaries, more than make up for the recuperation and strong units. MA arcosaphale also heals afflictions, has tough units, but has much better research, astral mages, access to many branches of magic, better castles, no mercenary penalty, and is a much better race endgame.

I would suggest giving the pan 1 additional
research point or dropping the cost to 300 gold.

RamsHead · #**156** April 26th, 2007, 07:26 PM

You shouldn't be recruiting Pans for research. Use Dryads and Black Dryads for that instead.

Xietor · #**157** April 27th, 2007, 12:34 AM

Ram,

I specifically said MA Pangaea who does not get black dryads. As for the White ones, they get a whooping 3 research for 110 gold! Though technically 3 for 110 is cheaper than 8 for 350,You are not going to win many research races getting 3 research a turn. Man's daughter of Avalon gets 4 for 80.

I could live with 4 research for 110 gold. But I would rather just pay the 350 gold and get 9 research with the pan, even though you can get 9 for 330 with 3 dryads as it presently stands.

The point is, pangaea's research could use a slight boost.
It is not like Pangaea is overpowered in MA in the least.

Graeme Dice · #**158** April 27th, 2007, 01:50 AM

Quote:

I specifically said MA Pangaea who does not get black dryads. As for the White ones, they get a whooping 3 research for 110 gold! Though technically 3 for 110 is cheaper than 8 for 350,You are not going to win many research races getting 3 research a turn.

I'm doing quite well in a MP game where all my research was performed by Mictlan priests in a drain 2 dominion, who give me only 2 research points per turn. You don't just add three research per turn, you add 9 research per turn out of three castles for the same upfront cost, and less than half the long term costs. The Dryad costs you 3.67 gold per turn, the Pan costs you 23.33 gold per turn. If it's just for research purposes, then you can afford to have 6.4 Dryads for every Pan over the long term. The Dryad is always cheaper on a gold cost/RP basis.

Xietor · #**159** April 27th, 2007, 10:05 AM

That is true, but early in the game, you have 1 castle. And initially, i like to produce Pans, until I get one with death bonus. I have several other reasons why i like having the pans
that are not related to research.

But the thrust of the thread, and my point, is not to debate the relative merits of researching with a dryad v Pan, they both could use some help in the research area. Yes, the dryad is slightly better than Pan at research, but they both are below average.

Conceding your point, then bumping the Pan to 9 research will not affect game balance at all.

Sombre · #**160** April 27th, 2007, 10:19 AM

If it won't affect game balance what's the point of doing it?