A couple of simple ways to make it more friendly - Page 2

Loren · #11 November 25th, 2006, 12:22 AM

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alexti said:

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Loren said:

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alexti said:
(1) That's weird. I can Alt-Tab back and forth while the turn calculation is being performed without any problem. It sounds more like something in OS scheduler being borked. User-mode application isn't even supposed to be able to totally monopolize computer resources.

It's not the OS scheduler--the machine is behaving fine and there is plenty of CPU power available (this is a hyperthread machine, Dominions can only monopolize it's processor, not the whole box.)

You can freely alt-tab back and forth while it's your turn. You can pretty freely alt-tab back and forth during battle resolution. What you can't do is alt-tab back and forth during AI calculation. I'm thinking that perhaps it is only checking the keyboard when it displays a message.

Ok, I probably never tried to do it during AI calculation. I haven't actually seen it take any significant amount of time (like 1 sec or more). Alt-tab is not checked by the program, but by the OS. If program is in infinitive loop and doesn't handle keyboard at all, alt-tab still works fine. One needs to make special effort to suppress alt-tab and it's somewhat tricky and Windows-specific. It's unlikely Dom3 does it. It seems strange that 'AI calculations' take so long. You may try to disable hyperthreading - sometimes it creates weird thread locking problems. Maybe OS scheduler and 'AI calculcations' are getting dead-locked on some semaphore (not sure what it might be though...) Sorry, I don't have any other ideas...

The problem is that Dominions isn't recognizing that it's been switched away and releasing the video. I think it's not monitoring the message queue while it's thinking.

This is a large map with many AI's, the "AI thinking" phase is measured in minutes (this turn, I'd say something like 10 minutes), especially since I got into quite a slugging match with my powerful neighbor. (On the main battlefront he's got at least 500 units in battle or marching towards it.) It wasn't nearly so bad while I was mostly squashing Atlantis but now Atlantis is gone. I've got 5 neighbors. 2 are basically at peace (one keeps throwing spells my way but there's been no other conflict) one has only two provinces of contact and we've never done anything to each other. One is the undead--they've got several hundred units in one square that they've done nothing with--since he's by far the most powerful empire I don't intend to start anything with him. That square is now a minimum of 5 provinces behind the battle line and I have no idea where the rest of his empire might be or how he came to have that pile on the one square. Finally there's the guy I'm fighting. He used to be ranked a bit higher by the game, by now I'm ranked a bit higher. Now that he's marching the big forces up it's gotten very slow and my shambler raids on his flank made it even worse. He's also doing a horrible job of countering the shamblers. There's a long path with low-supply terrain, I think the AI is having a hard time with the pathfinding.

Epaminondas · #12 November 25th, 2006, 12:34 AM

Loren, 10 minutes in terms of turn generation in a large map game?

Is this what I am supposed to expect even when I get a new computer shipped to me?

Jeez...

Endoperez · #13 November 25th, 2006, 08:11 AM

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Epaminondas said:
Loren, 10 minutes in terms of turn generation in a large map game?

Is this what I am supposed to expect even when I get a new computer shipped to me?

Jeez...

Well, with all nations in game, in a huge map, after 10-15 turns... Most nations will have at least one fight per turn. Just generating all of those takes time. In smaller maps, with fewer enemies, generation is much faster.

Cainehill · #14 November 25th, 2006, 01:22 PM

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Epaminondas said:
Loren, 10 minutes in terms of turn generation in a large map game?

Is this what I am supposed to expect even when I get a new computer shipped to me?

Jeez...

Yep, until/if Illwinter addresses the issue of graphics settings having an effect on turn generation times.

Epaminondas · #15 November 25th, 2006, 01:49 PM

Cainehill,

Does that mean turn generation will be significantly faster with reduced graphics setting? If it takes more than 1-2 minutes even in late game, I am going to be very annoyed.

Shovah32 · #16 November 25th, 2006, 02:15 PM

Lower settings does speed it up and annoyed you will probably be. The turn gen time can be ignored using various methods such as: having 2 game running at once, playing one while the other hosts. Browsing the internet while it hosts. Remembering to breath during play ect.

Epaminondas · #17 November 25th, 2006, 02:24 PM

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Shovah32 said:
Lower settings does speed it up and annoyed you will probably be. The turn gen time can be ignored using various methods such as: having 2 game running at once, playing one while the other hosts. Browsing the internet while it hosts. Remembering to breath during play ect.

LOL, Shovah. I will have two computers once my new one arrives, but the old one has busted CD-room drive. Perhaps I should fix that, get 2 copies of the game, and run the game on two computers!

alexti · #18 November 25th, 2006, 02:43 PM

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Loren said:
The problem is that Dominions isn't recognizing that it's been switched away and releasing the video. I think it's not monitoring the message queue while it's thinking.

You don't need to monitor message queue to get hidden or brought to the background. I could see why there might be a problem bringing Dom3 window in the foreground in this situation, but hiding it should be working. And when you refer to 10 minutes, is it just 'AI thinking' phase or total turn generation time? I'd imagine some combination of map and nation may produce longer 'AI thinking' times, but 10 minutes seem to be way too much from my experience (for me vast majority of turn generation time is spent in 'resolving battles').

Loren · #19 November 25th, 2006, 02:50 PM

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Epaminondas said:
Cainehill,

Does that mean turn generation will be significantly faster with reduced graphics setting? If it takes more than 1-2 minutes even in late game, I am going to be very annoyed.

Then don't play on the big maps. It's nice and quick on the small ones.

Furthermore, I think there's a pathfinding issue with the very long times I'm seeing--it only got bad when the AI I'm fighting started marching large armies around a complex, probably out of the way (I haven't mapped the extent of his empire yet) route to get to me. (This turn I sent over 200 heavy cav against over 300 of his units. I lost 1/4, he lost 1/2 and retreated.)

Epaminondas · #20 November 25th, 2006, 02:55 PM

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Loren said:

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Epaminondas said:
Cainehill,

Does that mean turn generation will be significantly faster with reduced graphics setting? If it takes more than 1-2 minutes even in late game, I am going to be very annoyed.

Then don't play on the big maps. It's nice and quick on the small ones.

Furthermore, I think there's a pathfinding issue with the very long times I'm seeing--it only got bad when the AI I'm fighting started marching large armies around a complex, probably out of the way (I haven't mapped the extent of his empire yet) route to get to me. (This turn I sent over 200 heavy cav against over 300 of his units. I lost 1/4, he lost 1/2 and retreated.)

Why should I not have the opportunity to explore the game in its full glory? If my recollections of Dom II is correct, you can't really get to the late spells and summons unless you play on a big map. I am not a fan of fast blitz-type of games, and if I did, I would play Starcraft online with 12 year-old kiddies from Seoul instead.