Some little odd things

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Christocipher

https://tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/n.../sdkfz-250.php that says 250 first used in France.

I looked a lot more and also found this. Yes you are right there were some preproduction models they are called Sd.Kfz. 250 0-Series then there is the mass-produced model which is called the Sd.Kfz. 250 Auf A or Auf B. Mass produced models Auf A and Auf B began Production in June 41 with 39, then 53 in July and 46 in August and 53 in September and about the same for the rest of the 1941 months. Maybe they got mostly held in the factories but some did appear in Russia and Africa. it says that anyway here.
https://gallery.kitmaker.net/data/22205/Image85.jpg
It looks like 15 0-Series got built Some might have got to france as they might be built before the Auf As and Auf Bs.
In this thread someone says a small number got built in 1940 thats probably the 0-Series.
https://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=136557

RE https://tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/n.../sdkfz-250.php

Yes, it does say they were used in France 1940 but that's the only source that does and they are incorrect

RE https://gallery.kitmaker.net/data/22205/Image85.jpg

Claims only a few were sent to the Eastern Front in 1941. 2 in September then 7 in October and 6 more in December 1941 with a couple going to Rommel in Libya in Dec as well. Note it says nothing about 1940

EDIT ----in that page scan are the dates they were SENT. Nothing is given in regards to arrival or when they were used on the front line which makes the start of 1942 much more likely than any other date with the info available


Wiki quotes Chamberlain, Peter, and Hilary L. Doyle. Thomas L. Jentz (Technical Editor). Encyclopedia of German Tanks of World War Two: A Complete Illustrated Directory of German Battle Tanks, Armoured Cars, Self-propelled Guns, and Semi-tracked Vehicles, 1933–1945. London: Arms and Armour Press, 1978 (revised edition 1993). ISBN 1-85409-214-6 that Production delays meant that the first vehicle did not appear until mid-1941.[1]

I have NO idea where the kitmaker quote came from but it supports that maybe 17 made it to anywhere at all in 1941 and as I said earlier we had them in service mid-1941 but changed it to the start of 1942 as that was more realistic representation of their availability. That kitmaker page scan also says the only unit to have a full company of them was the 24th Panzer. The 24th Panzer Division was formed in late 1941 but it did not enter combat on the Eastern Front until June 1942. Up until then, it was stationed in France.

IN THE GAME the 250 is a scout vehicle to start 1/42 as a two-unit section with larger formations starting in October 1942 when the PzAufk formations appeared, Recce work was always its purpose which is what the larger Aufklärungsabteilung formations are for

Bottom line is the only source that claims they were used in France in 1940 is the one you quoted

Finally....... I dusted off my copy of Schützenpanzer by Culver and Feist

What is PROBABLY causing the claim to be made that "250s" were in France in 1940 was that the SdKfz 253 artillery observation vehicle, which was the first model of the 250 series to be produced, and which from the side in photos looks very much like a 250/1, WAS in France in 1940 and that IS represented in the game that way with an in-service date of 5/1940

TECHNICALLY it could be claimed that vehicles of the 250 SERIES operated in France in 1940 but they were NOT the "regular" recce 250's. The tanks-encyclopedia.com info is wrong and misleading as it includes artwork claiming "Sd.Kfz.250/1 leichter Schützenpanzerwagen, France, June 1940".......which is flat out wrong

[Christocipher]

Glad to meet you Suhiir thanks for your help. Great game isnt it I think it has every weapon in ww2 in it, massive thanks to the people that built it. With the smoke I think it is not smoke ammo, I dont even think the MG bunker even has any smoke ammo. I think it is a smoke made when they fire so I think it would be a good idea if the developers could stop that or remove it because I dont think HMGs even if there is three of them like in a bunker make enough smoke to block the view but that is what I think is happening.
Thanks DRG yes I agree if there is only a few of something it should probably not be in the game.

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by DRG

I tried a test where I bought 6 emplacements and just auto deployed them and all but one showed suppression by turn 2

I tried another where I manually placed them and I kept them more or less close together by formation and they did not show supression to turn 6 when I stopped testing for the night so it may have to do with how close the subordinate units are from the command unit but testing is still ongoing

Problem is that while fortifications may be purchased as a group they're rarely deployed that way.

Live with it or get creative.
One could change the formation to "company" level then each individual fortification being "Platoon" level.
May "fix" the problem.

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Suhiir

Problem is that while fortifications may be purchased as a group they're rarely deployed that way.

Live with it or get creative.
One could change the formation to "company" level then each individual fortification being "Platoon" level.
May "fix" the problem.

OK....... try that and let me know what the result is.

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by DRG

OK....... try that and let me know what the result is.

A) If all the subordinate units are within 5 hexes of the HQ unit NO suppression.

B) If a subordinate unit is within 5 hexes of ANY other unit they seem to be suppressed much less often, if at all.

C) A SOLO (i.e. no subordinate units) fortification, even if it's the HQ unit, within, or outside of, command range of other units gets suppressed about 50% of the time often.

[Felix Nephthys]

Originally Posted by Suhiir

A) If all the subordinate units are within 5 hexes of the HQ unit NO suppression.

B) If a subordinate unit is within 5 hexes of ANY other unit they seem to be suppressed much less often, if at all.

C) A SOLO (i.e. no subordinate units) fortification, even if it's the HQ unit, within, or outside of, command range of other units gets suppressed about 50% of the time often.

Just wanted to add, I tend to play with Command set to off in my realism preferences, so this isn't a problem. I did notice the suppression to be about what Suhiir said above when I set Command to on, then it went away after I switched it off again.

[DRG]

The bottom line is if you leave units isolated and without visible support, they become "unhappy"

If they have other units nearby and they "know" they are not left hanging in the breeze they are less likely to become "unhappy"