Patriot SAM poor performance

[Mobhack]

what is kub and krub? - please provide OOB, unit numbers so I can find these.

Found that in the Russian OOB.

The missiles have equivalent accuracy and range, Patriot has a larger warhead and less minimum range. The launch units, the Patriot has better radar and EW.

Therefore Patriot will be dong better at shooting planes down than the kub, given a decent sample set of firings.

[Isto]

They are famous russian systems developed in 70s. Codename kvadrat and so.

Maybe nato calls them gainful.

[Mobhack]

I work on NATO reporting names, so I know what a Sunburn or SS-N-22 is, not some other name.

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by Isto

Why would the missile detonate close enough ?

Almost all AA missiles (air or ground launched) have a tiny radar detonator in them. They rarely actually hit their target, they just get "close enough" and explode sending shrapnel all over. Aircraft are, by necessity, fairly fragile targets.

Originally Posted by Isto

So they are going against direct orders, shouldnt that take them to military court on defying direct orders from their superiors ?

Can infantry do the same without being deserters ? Abandon their posts if an artillery barrage comes close enough, im sure that happens though.

Yes/No.

Yes they have a target/mission, BUT they're also entrusted with several hundreds, if not millions of dollars of aircraft their bosses REALLY expect them to bring home in once piece. The WW II Japanese did Kamikazes, no one else really thinks that's a good idea.

[Aeraaa]

^In addition to that, there's the rather obvious detail that you cannot perform your duty/mission while you're dead (or shot down, which is the same for all intents or purposes). So, if you've encountered stronger resistance than expected, retreating is the most sane thing to do.

That isn't to say that retreating does not entail danger of its own. I mean yeah, you CAN potentially be held accountable for not completing your mission depending on the army you serve, the attitude of your superior officer etc. However, few nations are willing to expend pilots for a successful mission. After all, planes can be send to battle again if they are still flyable.

[zovs66]

Originally Posted by Isto

Still what you posted seems like propaganda to me. It contradicts strongly with the words of a president. What should we believe if not our leaders.

Not trying to start an argument but really? I don't believe anything any of "our" leaders say, they are all liars. They are not experts in military or technical matters.

What we should believe is what the research shows, not what politicians say.

And on the field of battle you still can't trust the 'higher ups' at times. Prior to us going to combat they told us to expect 75% or higher casualties. We received 5%.

I just listened to U.S. Marines that were going to shore on Iwo that it had been pounded for six months and that there is nothing to worry about and its should only take 5 to 7 days to mop up the Island. It took 30 days and the Marines lost more than the Japanese.

[Suhiir]

Yep.
Did Gulf I myself and until a week or so before the ground phase kicked off I was expecting 50ish% casualties from mostly the chemical threat. But luckily I was working Intel at the time and dealing with the Iraqi deserters and satellite footage of chemicals being shipped back to Iraq from Kuwait thus knew the casualties wouldn't nearly that bad. But damn few others had the luxury of being in a position that allowed them to know what I did.

The days of throwing bodies at a problem are over for most people. Even the Chinese make sure their people have decent equipment, if not training, to much political indoctrination.

[Imp]

Couple of points
Firstly are the planes that fire first SEAD planes, they would detect the Patriot without it firing a shot?


EW rating does not guarantee a hit just improves the chance. The bigger the difference the bigger the improvement so just like most equipment older stuff with low EW ratings are in trouble.

Handling air in MBT is problematic anyway the planes already run the gauntlet Area Sam's should have taken them out long before they reached the map you are now in the domain of other Sam units that should protect the Area Sam's.

The game may in a roundabout way be fairly accurate if they made it that close its probably due to poor radar coverage because of terrain & the guys manning the Sam are probably bricking it by now.

The US has a problem in that it relies on the air force to stop the planes backed up by the Patriot where as the likes of Russia have several different units to form a layered defence.

I would guess none of the systems work as well as advertised against a modern aircraft let alone drones & missiles.

[retiredgysgt]

The few times I have fired a sead at an air defense unit they shut down their radar as you fire which generally lowers the chance for a hit.

[DRG]

The change to 4 ROF I made helps. I have no idea why they were set to 2 when other SAMS have a ROF that equal their missile count so now they match the others which gives more opportunities to hit and that is the last OOB change I am making and code work ended 2 weeks ago