Opening Strategies - Page 2

Lisif Deoral · #11 March 24th, 2002, 08:41 PM

quote:
Originally posted by baetis:
Hey Folks,

So i was wondering if there are any other things that you *always* do at the start of a game that might not be so obvious to a less experienced player.

I'm noy exactly an experienced player, or maybe I was... I disinstalled the game Last summer and reinstalled it only about 10 days ago.
Anyway, I usually build an escort explorer ship in the first turn (making sure I can complete it in 1 turn), then build at least a colony ship (even if there's no colonizable planet in your home system). What follows depends on the specific situation.
I usually don't use many space yard bases - anyway, I tipically play with low starting resources and other nuisances (like "players may start in the same system") that encourage improvisation, and I have played only a single of multiplayer game (where I didn't fare well at all...).

capnq · #12 March 24th, 2002, 09:36 PM

I usually and add storage facilities as needed, if I have the space. One trick is to put the storage facility on a planet that can produce a decent yield of that resource; when you start running a large deficit instead of a surplus, and drain off enough of your stockpile, you can scrap the storage facility and build a resource producer in it's place.

[ 24 March 2002: Message edited by: capnq ]

rextorres · #13 March 24th, 2002, 09:50 PM

This all may sound obvious, but I'll give my 2 cents anyways.

SEIV is like any 4X game it's just a huge land grab. The key to winning is to expand, expand, expand. The best tactics won't beat an empire that has a larger economic base that can outspend and outresearch an opponent.

Build colony ships with your home planets almost exclusively. Switch to defensive ships when you have first contact - but continue to grow especially if your opponent is friendly - in a game with humans this almost always the case. The computer will invariably attack you until you get a treaty.

Start your new planets with a weapons platform so the enemy doesn't destroy your colony with the lone explorer ship then build as many research facilities in your home system as possible until you start going into negative - keeping up with the joneses on techology is a key to winning.

When you colonize the next system first thing you should build is your platform for protection then your next shipyard and start the whole aforementioned colonizing process over. Send a cargo ship with colonists so that the new colony doesn't run out.

Once you go into negative on minerals then you start building mineral facilities to catch up on resources.

Build the storage facility mentioned previously, but one should be enough if your expanding at the proper pace. If you have lots of excess resources then your not growing fast enough.

There lots of ways to optimize this growth, but I'll let others give ideas.

Fyron · #14 March 24th, 2002, 10:05 PM

If you don't make some space yard stations to utilize your extra resources, then it will be a while before you start to reach negative income levels.

PvK · #15 March 24th, 2002, 11:03 PM

quote:
Originally posted by augustinetorres:
...SEIV is like any 4X game it's just a huge land grab. The key to winning is to expand, expand, expand. The best tactics won't beat an empire that has a larger economic base that can outspend and outresearch an opponent.

Unless you're playing with the Proportions mod.

PvK

tesco samoa · #16 March 25th, 2002, 01:57 AM

IF it is a 3 planet low tech start.
I scrap 1 mineral factory and build a mineral storage ( on each planet).

Then I build 3 space yards.

Then I scrap 2 mineral factories and build another mineral storage and an organic or rad storage ( on each planet)
Then I should have computers level 1 done so I will scrap 2 more mineral factories and build the computer and robotic factories.

Mean while the space yards have been producing 1 colony ship 1 scout ( 2 times through ) and 1 defence or attack ship ( I just put the colony and attack ship on repeat ). Then I set the scout builder to build 2 more space yards.

On new colony planets I build space yard first ( if greater than 2 slots )
If 1 to 2 slots then I put a research on it ( this is for later when I have atmosphere converters so they can take that research slot)
If 3 slots on a planet then a ship yard, (if one of the minerals is above 100 % then that factory and a reseach fac. if not then just research )
If 4 slots then same as 3 slots .

If 6 slots then space yard and ( follow the 100% rule ) either 4 research and 1 computer or 3 of the factories and 2 research

If 12 or greater then lots of research and a few more storage facilities

But if the planet has one of the minerals above 100% then I will build that factory 24 times with a robotic factory , ship yard and some research slots .

Ship yards decrease build time.

Storage will save you later in the game ( actually at the turn 25 to 50 range when a lack of one of the minerals will really slow you down.)

For reseach....

Computers, PPB's, ships, planet util, and cargo.

Get cargo done early. It will help.

By turn 60 you want atmosphere converter 1 done and mineral converters ....

Gozra · #17 March 25th, 2002, 02:52 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Make sure to build storage facilities to store any and all excess resources produced in the early game. It's much better to have, say, 210000 minerals stored than it is to have only 50000 when you start to build more than you can support. Store a lot more minerals than rads or organics. If you're and organic race, store about 1/3 to 1/2 as many organics as you do minerals. You don't need to store very many rads, because they aren't used very much
Get Solar Panel IIIs quickly and place a few supply ships outfitted with them in each fleet. This extends their range significantly.

And about the 3 spaceyards per homeworld, make sure to get them built ASAP. Unless there are huge (or maybe large) planets of your atmosphere in your home system, get these space yards built in the first 6 turns. If their are huge worlds, build a colony ship or two and get them colonized ASAP. They are the first priority. And don't limit yourself to 3 space yards at each homeworld. When you reach a point where you consistently have a large surplus in your income, build more space yards. Try to minimize the budget surplus.

I must point out that warp point ships openers and closers cost a lot to make and run in rad points. So if you have a game in which these type of ships are important then radioactives become important. "gozguy"

Gozra · #18 March 25th, 2002, 03:24 AM

I have come across some truisms in SEIV that fit any type of game. Keep in mind the 2 basic type of games you can have In SEIV 1)Stars all connected 2) Stars not connected by warp points.
1st Truism. If it has an orbit Colonize it.
2nd T. Fill the colony worlds fast with population.
3rd T. Research applied research as the first big project.
4th T. Fighters + Mines = AI's Can't get you.

Industry -> Computers + Robotics = Greater production and research capablities
Population+ happiness= Greater production of everything.
I am not sure slow big Colony ships are THE answer. But it might be.

Fyron · #19 March 25th, 2002, 03:51 AM

quote:
I must point out that warp point ships openers and closers cost a lot to make and run in rad points. So if you have a game in which these type of ships are important then radioactives become important. "gozguy"

True, stellar manipulation is very Rad expensive, but so what? By the time you get around to using it, you should be making enough Rads to cover the costs, or you should be able to convert Organics or Minerals to Rads to cover the costs. And games where not all warp points are connected are the exception, not the rule.

quote:
4th T. Fighters + Mines = AI's Can't get you.

True, unless you play against good modded AIs, like the TDM ones. If you play against humans, then they won't help you much past the early game.

quote:
I am not sure slow big Colony ships are THE answer. But it might be.

IMO, the answer is Light Cruiser hull colony ships. They are large enough to have stealth armor, a colony module, 6 engines, and leave you with 80 spaces for cargo bays and/or supply storage/solar panels. When you get solar sails, you lose out on one of those cargo bays, but that's not a problem. Med./Large Transports are nice if you want a high starting population, but they get to be expensive.

Bman · #20 March 25th, 2002, 04:51 PM

Everyone is talking about building cargo storage early on. I say fooey on that. If you have surplus minerals after about 10 turns in a 1-planet start then you are doing something wrong and not expanding fast enough. And during the first 10 turns your planet should be busy building space station yards and colony ships. If you waste 3 slots on cargo storage, that's 1500 research points per turn or 1800+ resources per turn you could be getting instead. That pays the mineral cost required by a working space-yard each turn! With those extra points you can expand that much faster.

In a recent MP game I conquered another empire that only had about 6 planets to my 30 when we met and I was his only neighbor. I didn't understand it, but as I landed troops on all of his planets I kept finding resource storage units.

My strategy in the early game is to operate in the red and constantly increase my resource PRODUCTION so I can produce more faster. Send out colony ships like crazy and research some combat technologies early (either ship size or weapons or shields or armor or sensors or something) so that when you make first contact you will be able to build a ship capable of holding its own.