Can't get more than 5 neutral races

[Prince Xizor]

Granted I'm still learning PvK's Proportions mod, but based on what I know so far if you manage to subjugate a neutral early on, you'd have a huge advantage. The solution would be to have more neutrals so everybody has a chance to grab one or two. So, yeah, I hope this bug gets fixed in any final patch. It may not be priority, but it doesn't seem like it would be too difficult to fix.

My two cents.

[Atrocities]

Originally posted by Prince Xizor:
I'm trying to get all six neutrals into my game. I tried editing the "min/max neutral player" lines in Settings.txt, but I never get more than five. Is this a bug?

Not a bug, but a problem that has not yet been addressed.

[Alari]

Originally posted by Atrocities:
Not a bug, but a problem that has not yet been addressed.

Uh....? Doublespeak? :>

Seriously, is there a difference betweeen a bug and a "problem that has not yet been addressed"? Some kind of distinction between the two?

IMHO bugs should be fixed as soon as they are found. Leaving bugs around because not enough people are complaining is.. well, something that might make me reconsider buying the next Version or other titles, if I wasn't such a sucker for supporting small game publishers and companies.

[Fyron]

It is quite possible that only allowing 5 neutrals in a game was an intentional feature, you know. Shouldn't be IMO, and the fact that there is no mention of it anywhere would suggest that it wasn't intentional, but you never know.

Keep in mind that there is a lot to work on, and bugs can often be very difficult to track down. MM fixes as many bugs as they can in a reasonable time frame for only having one programmer in the company (one person in the company to begin with). Also, stuff has to be prioritized. Minor bugs (according to MM's prioritizations) tend to get less attention and fixed later than major bugs (things like TDBs doing 4x damage to ALL targets, regardless of shielding are rather major). The number of neutrals allowable is a very minor bug in comparison to other bugs. MM's track record for fixing bugs and such in patches is one of the best in the industry.

[ September 08, 2003, 03:06: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

[Alari]

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
It is quite possible that only allowing 5 neutrals in a game was an intentional feature, you know. Shouldn't be IMO, and the fact that there is no mention of it anywhere would suggest that it wasn't intentional, but you never know.

in data/settings.txt:


Minimum Neutral Player Low Setting := 1
Maximum Neutral Player Low Setting := 5
Minimum Neutral Player Medium Setting := 5
Maximum Neutral Player Medium Setting := 10
Minimum Neutral Player High Setting := 10
Maximum Neutral Player High Setting := 15


... these settings exist. If it was hard-coded why would they be here? (My Version of these are modified. Dunno what the original settings are)

And whether a bug is minor or major is a matter of perspective, isn't it? Granted, show-stoppers like crashes and such would be agreed to be major by all. You think the TDB bug is major whereas I don't even remember what that stands for.

[ September 08, 2003, 03:30: Message edited by: Alari ]

[Fyron]

The settings do work, just not over 5. Try putting them on 1 or something.

TDB = Time Distortion Burst, a Temporal weapon. That was definitely a show-stopper and required using a mod to remove the 4x to shields ability.

[Alari]

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
The settings do work, just not over 5. Try putting them on 1 or something.

TDB = Time Distortion Burst, a Temporal weapon. That was definitely a show-stopper and required using a mod to remove the 4x to shields ability.

You know that they don't work properly. If one neutral was what I was trying to get, I wouldn't be here, would I?

And from what you described, TDB seems to be a less major bug than the number of neutrals. After all, it can be fixed by a mod, whereas I can't get the number of neutrals over 5 no matter what I do.

[Fyron]

And whether a bug is minor or major is a matter of perspective, isn't it?

Yes, and the perspective that matters is that of MM. Not that I speak for MM or anything.

[Fyron]

Originally posted by Alari:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
The settings do work, just not over 5. Try putting them on 1 or something.

TDB = Time Distortion Burst, a Temporal weapon. That was definitely a show-stopper and required using a mod to remove the 4x to shields ability.

You know that they don't work properly. If one neutral was what I was trying to get, I wouldn't be here, would I?

And from what you described, TDB seems to be a less major bug than the number of neutrals. After all, it can be fixed by a mod, whereas I can't get the number of neutrals over 5 no matter what I do.

---

TDB was fixed. It was a major issue because it had the potential to ruin dozens of PBW games. And it is not the only bug of such severity to have appeared over the years (not been discovered, but appeared accidentally). Neutrals are fairly pointless as they are very easy to overrun. Having a lot of them just makes the game really easy to win. This is why I said that the number of neutrals is a minor issue. Much better off playing multiplayer.

I don't see why we are still arguing about this. We both want it fixed.

[Alari]

I would think it would be the perspectives of their customers, the ones who pay for their software and keep them in business. ^.^

But like I said, I support small game companies when I can.

edit: and I want it fixed too. :> I didn't realize we were arguing. But I don't think neutrals are pointless, and from what I've heard they can be made fairly challenging with the right AI files.

[ September 08, 2003, 04:06: Message edited by: Alari ]