(OT) Some advice for me / My Depression Thread / Thanks forumers

[narf poit chez BOOM]

even if being socail doesn't come natural, you can still learn the rules...and humor's great. just make sure you know what kind of humor your good at.

[dogscoff]

it all narrows down to physical activities and i agree that this is important. i, though, have never been active in that area ... it is a change in my life that is yet to come but i hope it will.

Well you have to make that change yourself. Go and try out a few sports. My schools were all focussed on ppl with exceptional talent when it came to sport- anyone who was just mediocre like me was practically excluded. For that reason I hated all forms of excerise throughout my childhood and teens.

Then, after nearly getting beaten up one New Year's Eve- I went to a karate class. I loved it. It really changed the way I felt about myself, and for a short while I had a body like Jean-Claude Van Damme One day I'll find that guy who nearly beat me up and thank him for introducing me to martial arts.

Anyway, I've been doing karate on and off for about 6 or 7 years, and I've now moved on to judo, which is just as good.

[Aloofi]

Originally posted by dogscoff:


Anyway, I've been doing karate on and off for about 6 or 7 years, and I've now moved on to judo, which is just as good.

Wow, karate for seven years?
you must have at least a 2nd Dan-jo.
Which style?

I took Karate since i was 12, then I got drafted by the IDF, and while serving I took the 1st Dan-Jo test, just to be able to say that I have a black belt.
But I officially quit, I haven't learn anything since then. I guess I'm never gonna get the 2nd or 3rd Dan. Getting the 1st was hard enough, and I have forgotten a lot of the non-practical tecniques that I had to learn to pass the test.
Joshimon style, by the way.
I've heard that the Shotokan and the ****o-ryu are the most populars in Europe.

.

[Aloofi]

Originally posted by Taera:
considering my hebrew experience ill never become absolutely fluent in english but im getting better.

On the contrary, you will get a lot better and very fluent, because the more Languages you speak the more fluent you get in all at the same time. You gonna have a fairly easier time with a 3rd language than with a 2nd.

.

[Loser]

I used to dwell on High School, going over it in my mind again and again. I came to the conclusion that, if I had to opportunity to 'go back through' that period of my life know only one thing that I know now, I would want to know how little all the things I worried about ended up mattering.

Once, when I was out with some friends, this specific subject came up and a friend voiced the same opinion I had. I was about to comment on how eerie or meaningful that was when another fellow spoke up to say that he'd rather tell his younger self "Deal coke, not weed"... which completely sidetracked the conversation.

That said, I agree with what so many others here have said: the best step to getting out of depression is physical activity. It changes your chemistry and gives you strength on a variety of levels.

I have always been puzzled by how well others seem to understand each other, always under the impression that they expected a degree of communication in which I simply had no experience. The young lady I'm currently seeing has told me that I have no social sense, no intuitive understanding of others, no connection to the common mind. It is directly because of this that I am a very social person. I have strove to gain an intellectual, conscious awareness of body language, tone, and implications. I have elevated my social skill to the point that I am regarded as odd and amusing rather than frightening or repugnant. Yay.

I believe that the way I have developed would help anyone with any sort of social troubles and it is a simple solution: make people talk. If you are at any sort of gathering (family, social, religious, sacrilegious) and you notice that one person standing, sitting, walking (but not ever dancing) by themselves approach them and try to get them talking. Question their interests, question them about their interests, find out how strange and new things work, ask them about their political interests. The goal here is not to 'talk with' someone, but to get them talking. This will require you to respond on occasion, and to prod fairly frequently. Failure to speak with one of these wall flowers will have little to no consequences; success will result in a raised level of confidence, increase in conversational skill levels, and maybe a new friend or at least a friendly acquaintance.

Next move on to strangers. Pick people doing work that does not require their entire attention, so you have less of a chance of 'bothering' them. Retail floor personnel, street vendors, anyone who looks like their day could use a little more excitement is a good choice. Start with a blunt approach, so they know what you want: "Could I ask you a few questions?" Ask them about what they do, how they got there, if they went to school for it, how they track inventory.

By this time your conversational skill should have advanced to the point that you have a much easier time 'making friends'. Remember the key to being seen as a 'good conversationalist' is to make the other person feel like talking. People like it when someone want to hear what they have to say. Now you should read "How to Win Friends and Influence People", and American self-help book from the early twentieth century. It is targeted for sales personnel, so don't be surprised if some of it isn't exactly applicable, but it is a highly helpful book.

To work on more complicated conversational techniques, play games with strangers. Really this all started with a game: "Make the Stranger Talk".

One I like is "Name Tag Collection", where I try to talk complete strangers into giving me (or selling me) something insignificant but personal, like their name tag. This requires that the person is something of a captive; retail personnel and theme park employees are best really. This is also good practice at talking to girls: males react to this game as though I am threatening them in some way, while girls do not get threatened for some time. Also, since you are laying out your goal immediately, they don't spend as much time wondering what your really after, not right away, anyway. Don't study them before you approach them, as this will give them time to notice you and start wondering, worrying, or calling security (just kidding), just walk up and ask "May I ask you a question? Would you get in trouble if you lost your name tag?"

Another good one is "Get a job". Go into a place of business and ask if they are hiring. You don't really want to work there, you're just doing this for the experience (but don't' tell them that). Ask them what they do, what the hours are like, but don't ask about pay. If they offer you an application, take it, just to keep the game going. Your goal here is to get an interview right away, so ask if there's a manager there to speak with. Now take the interview like you need the job. The great part is that you don't, you don't care. This puts you in a position of power that the interviewer won't be expecting and is great fun. It will also help you develop good interviewing skills, as you're never as secure or ready to learn when you're in the middle of a stressed-up for-real interview.

A good game to help you with inhibitions is "Sing First, Then Sell". When a telemarketer, surveyor, or charity calls on the phone, tell them that you will listen to their spiel, but only after they sing with you. The two of you will have to have a few songs in common for this to work. IF they don't immediately agree (and they never do), talk about what song you could use for a minute. Since they're still not quite ready to sing with you, tell them you'll listen if they join in on the chorus and just start singing. You don't have to know all the words or even have the melody quite right. In fact, if more fun when you aren't singing the song right.

Then pick the areas you want to work on, make up your own games, and stat adding a moment of sureality to some strangers world.

I don't' know if this will help you but I encourage you to give it a try. Talking with people who you will never see again is easy because it won't matter if you screw up, what're they going to do?

[Chronon]

Taera, I had very similar experiences in high school (it seems like many of us did). Now that I'm more than twenty years removed from them, I have a sense of perspective about them, but (surprise) they still hurt. I wouldn't go through those years again if you paid me. So, if it's any help, you're not alone in your experiences.

I'll bet, though, that you have a much better time of it at the university. You'll have a much better chance of meeting like-minded people, and he straight-jacket of conformity is a bit looser there because everyone is exploring their identities a bit more freely. Also, there are more diverse students and lifestyles, not everyone has come from the same place.

So, you have something to look forward to, but that doesn't help you now. You've already got some great advice about that, so I'll just add a couple of things here.

I have just recently started judo, and it's great. The physical activity is excellent for my depressed moods, it gives me a nice sense of mental and physical balance, and I feel more self confident dealing with people. I really should have done this when I was your age, when I really needed it (I was the hallway punching bag when I was 13). There are plenty of good martial arts available, from aikido to taikwondo, with a wide range of styles, levels of aggressiveness, and philosophical/spiritual levels. Just something to think about, anyway.

About your attractive friend - I can't stress enough what others have said here. These things take time, and friendship is an excellent way to begin a Lasting romantic relationship. My wife and I have been together for 18 years, been married for 11 of those, and she's still my best friend. Listen, really listen, to what she's telling you. Trust and good communication are the building blocks for a good relationship, and you'd be surprised at what she'll tell you about her hopes and fears if you are open to them. Eventually you will know her well enough as a friend to know if there's romance ahead. And even if there's not, you'll still be able to discuss it with her because you are good friends.

Lastly, and perhaps most importantly, hold on to your dreams. Even if it takes some time, you can make them happen. For those of us who have a tough time in high school, life does get better!

[minipol]

Taera,

first off all (as other people on this forum) i didn't have an easy youth. To much to sum up here but sufice it to say that i can relate to some of your comments.
The impression that i get from your story is that you used to have a nice social life in your homecountry. If that is the case, the problem isn't your social skills rather a problem adapting to the country you're in. And maybe like you mentioned not having mastered the language in such a level so you feel confident to talk to complete strangers.

Anyhow, join a sportsclub, computerclub, chess club anything that makes you leave the house. I for example tend to be a loner yet i like people too. So i drive myself out of the house: i have started my own indoor soccer team (we are playing the cup final in the competition we are in, woohoo ) and i took up American Football here (Belgium). Choose something you like and join a club. really. This will let you meet people with the same interests and that will put the focus on the sport, or what the club does and not on say, you not speaking perfect english or whatever. After you have a few friends, you automatically meet friends of those friends and the ball starts rolling.

As for the girl, i wouldn't try anything if you're not at ease with yourself. Make sure you feel allright about yourself before you try anything. Otherwise it will make a relationship harder and i talk from experience. Nearly ended my relationship with the girl that now is my wife
But if you feel so super strongly about this girl that it hurts, i would make sure my feelings are genuine ( not a simple crush that goes away after you see another beautiful girl) and then talk to her. If you talk to her, do not immediately say: "i'm in love". Start with something humorous and give little hints that you like her and that you find her beautiful. It will give her time to adjust and not be overwhelmed.
And when you go for her, be prepared to lose her friendship although i know plenty of people who experienced something similar and are still friends with the person that had a crush on them.
So it's possible to stay friends.

Hope this helps

[dogscoff]

Wow, karate for seven years?
you must have at least a 2nd Dan-jo.
Which style?

No, seven years on and off, as in "1 year training, 8 months not training > back to white belt > 1 year training > 1 year not training > back to white belt..." ...for seven years. I never got more than about 3 or 4 belts in, and this time when life got too busy to continue training (about 9 months ago) I couldn't face relearning all the same stuff from scratch yet again. So I took up Judo. I'll probably go back to karate eventually, but I need a break, and I need to get fit again.

Oh, and shotokan- always shotokan.

And Loser- Do you really play those games? LOL!

[Erax]

Originally posted by Chronon:
Taera, I had very similar experiences in high school (it seems like many of us did). Now that I'm more than twenty years removed from them, I have a sense of perspective about them, but (surprise) they still hurt. I wouldn't go through those years again if you paid me. So, if it's any help, you're not alone in your experiences.

[shiver]. Same here, although in my case it was almost entirely verbal abuse. But yes, the memories still hurt, twenty years later.

Hmmm... maybe I should rename a couple of neutral races, scan in some images from my old yearbooks and start a Genocide Game...

[Taera]

it is very funny how my thinking differs from time to time - better say mood to mood - i guess thats what they all talk about when saying 'teenagers'

yes, obviously this thread helped me.

(notice - the following post is made in one of my good moods. it also has a big load of me talking about myself which is very uncommon )

minipol, your impression is correct. i had a fine social life in Israel but i didnt take the right path ehre and there.. and it had built over a long time and a lot of suffering in school. bad times i dont like to think about

for my situation now it seems i've been pretty lucky - untill grade 8 i have almost never been beaten lol (only by big Groups) and then i abandoned all violence from my side because i didnt like it. at all. and i managed to live since then without a single quarrel with people.

and i took to great pains to remove my naturally
high shyness -- and surprisingly for the Last year-and-half ive been very successful. i taught myself not to be shy with girls and been successful so thats not an issue. what is is my lack of experience in beyond-friendship boy-girl relationships but hey, im only recently turned 17 and will have chances to learn, i guess.

just sometimes i feel very bored and very lonely on those evening lol because theres nothing for me to do *sigh* ohwell.

Thanks for the advice regarding karate and stuff. frankly as i said ive been avoiding fights and now dont have any knowledge there should i get into trouble (and my demeanor sometimes takes me to risks lol but ive been lucky till now) and i've always been interested in martial arts... just never took any.

ahh crap thats a lot of positive talking aint it
that girl... i wont talk about that much... but i usually talk to her every day -- that is, via MSN. she's a rare kind of computer-literate girl
we'll see where it goes. for now, i have a good mood

EDIT: minipol, thought over what you said (possible fast-forgettable crush) and thought i'd add - what you said, i've considered the option too, doesnt seem so.

[ May 23, 2003, 01:48: Message edited by: Taera ]