Magic Items Suggestions

[Endoperez]

NTJedi said:

No... how do you justify everything being exactly identical just because it's a fictional magical realm?? Show me the information or history which backs up your theory.

Don't you think it's a little ridiculous to demand information and history to back up arguments about fiction?

Just because something is fictional does not mean all traits of a similar item have to be perfectly identical. Each of those 100 enchanted spears are forged from ore or steal or a combination of metals, in a magical realm some of the metals used have a chance of being magical allowing a greater variation compared with normal reality. The identical setup of forged items is done within Dominions to simplify the progamming code not because it matches realistic fantasy realms.

It simplifies programming, reduces micromanagement, and in general, is a good choice. However, it could be argued that every magical item is actually duplication of a platonic, ideal "perfect sword" or "perfect shield" or "undead-killing sword". Remember, the artifacts can be re-forged! If magic is used to duplicate an existing idea to the smallest detail, the statistics are always exactly the same.

[OG_Gleep]

NTJedi said:
No... how do you justify everything being exactly identical just because it's a fictional magical realm?? Show me the information or history which backs up your theory.

I can't believe you just said that.

The identical setup of forged items is done within Dominions to simplify the progamming code not because it matches realistic fantasy realms.

Realistic Fantasy.... read that back a few times and maybe you'll see my point.

[Twan]

Fate said:

Shouldn't a level be added at levels 1, 3(+2), 6(+3), and 10(+4) in other schools? Then it fits evenly into 10, otherwise it maxes out at 7, after granting 3 more levels. An alternative is making it use 1, 4(+3), and 10(+6).

Yes perhaps I've too much prevently nerfed this item. My goal was to make hard to gain more than 5 levels with it, even with a powerful rainbow pretender.

But it may be better to hardcode the maximum and make it gives for example 1 level for 1-2, 2 for 3-5, 3 for 6-9, 4 for 10-14 and 5 for 15+.

[Twan]

Some other ideas :

forgers becoming the item... (probably too much work to code this kind of things but a fun idea)

My Own Demilich Skull (very powerful death 6 item) : to forge this item the death mage must kill himself, as his own skull will become the demilich one. The demilich skull can then be carried by another character and will randomly cast spells in battle its forger was able to cast (but will be of no use to cast ritual spells). Like Carcator demiliches generally tend to be grumpy and often cast curses even on their own troops. A pretender god becoming an item can't be called back as long as the item is in game.

Controling Soul (astral 5-6 vp misc) : to create this item the astral mage must definitivly quit his physical body, becoming this globe of astral energy. The controling soul can then be carried by another character and will take control of one of his ennemies in every battle (MR negates but the controling soul has a penetration bonus equal to the astral level of the item creator ; this enslave mind spell is casted every round untill an ennemy fails, but the soul can only take control of one per fight). But this power is not the most exceptionnal of a controling soul : this indestructible globe will always be found if his wielder dies in battle, and has such a powerful spirit that it may control even its finder. An ennemy commander finding the controling soul will be seduced like by a succubus if he fails his MR check (pretenders gods are of course immune).

Living Demonic Sword (very powerful blood 4 two handed sword) : to forge this item the blood mage must infuse a sword with his own blood, killing himself in the process, but transfering his soul and some of his powers into it. The dammage done by a demonic sword are based on the skills of its creator in elemental magic. The physical dammages this sword may done are increased by 3 by level he had in earth magic, and the sword gets one more attack by other elemental path practiced by its forger, doing 3 points of appropriate dammage by level he had (ie if he was a fire 3 air 2 blood 4 the sword will have a fire 9 dmg and an electrical 6 dmg attack in addition). The wielder of this sword will also gain 1 to his blood magic skill by 3 points the sword creator had in blood, and 1 to each statistic by 8 points its forger had in it. A pretender god becoming an item can't be called back as long as the item is in game.

Living Diabolic Sword (very powerful blood 4 two handed sword) : to forge this item the blood mage must infuse a sword with his own blood, killing himself in the process, but transfering his soul and some of his powers into it. The dammage done by a diabolic sword are based on the skills of its creator in arcane magic. The attack of the diabolic sword will be armor negating if he had 3 or more in astral magic, have a drain strength power if he had 3 or more in death magic, and will be poisonous in proportion to his nature skill (from weak poison for 1 to death poison for 6+), and the sword will give its user a berserking hability with a bonus equal to the skill of the creator in blood. The wielder of this sword will also gain 1 to his blood magic skill by 3 points the sword creator had in blood, and 1 to each statistic by 8 points its forger had in it. A pretender god becoming an item can't be called back as long as the item is in game.

(the same may be done for armors, demonic living armor giving resists or auras based on the elemental paths of the creator, diabolic living armor giving powers like etheral form if created by an astral mage, regeneration for nature, cursing attackers for death, + the general stat/blood bonuses)


more items having control powers on magical creatures (with a powerful but very situationnal power, good counters against some strategies) :

Crown of Elemental Control (1 by elemental path, greater or vp item needing about 3-4 levels in the school) : This crown will try to take control of all ennemy elementals each round. (a MR check will be done for each elemental creature of the item school in the ennemy army each round, the elemental is controlled for the round if it fails).

Crown of the Seasons (nature 4-5 greater or vp item) : this crown will try to take control of all seasonnal spirits in the ennemy army each round.

Crown of the Ingenior (earth item, same effect on mechanical men and clockwork horrors)

etc...

or even non magical creatures, but less efficiently :

Ring of Human influence : this ring will try to control the human ennemy soldiers close to you (MR check for all ennemy humans in a 5 or 10 range or control for the round).

Rings/Crowns of Troll/Lizardmen/Tritons influence, (etc...)

[NTJedi]

OG_Gleep said:

I can't believe you just said that.

It's the same as you saying that elves are 100feet tall with glowing pink noses... you have zero history to backup your statement.

OG_Gleep said:Realistic Fantasy.... read that back a few times and maybe you'll see my point.

As mentioned earlier by Endoperez, "It simplifies programming, reduces micromanagement, and in general, is a good choice." The identical setup of forged items is also done within Dominions to simplify the progamming code not because it matches realistic fantasy realms. If your statement was true then games like Diablo_2 and the RPG Might&Magic would be wrong for having random variations of the items found.
What you are suggesting is UNRealistic Fantasy where all weapons, items, people are exactly the same.

**edit in Might&Magic I refer to sequel#4 thru #7 because those are the ones I played.

Endoperez said:
However, it could be argued that every magical item is actually duplication of a platonic, ideal "perfect sword" or "perfect shield" or "undead-killing sword". Remember, the artifacts can be re-forged! If magic is used to duplicate an existing idea to the smallest detail, the statistics are always exactly the same.

Sure it's possible every magical item is a perfect duplication... but the same as if every child in a magical realm suddenly were identical with blue eyes and blonde hair... there'd have to be a mystical reason behind this event. Imagine reading a fictional book where all houses were exactly identical yet no reason was ever explained... unrealistic fantasy. My point is if no reason, history or information exists to backup this theory then it's unrealistic fantasy.

[Fate]

Twan said:

Yes perhaps I've too much prevently nerfed this item. My goal was to make hard to gain more than 5 levels with it, even with a powerful rainbow pretender.

But it may be better to hardcode the maximum and make it gives for example 1 level for 1-2, 2 for 3-5, 3 for 6-9, 4 for 10-14 and 5 for 15+.

Yeah, that would work. Whatever happens, it is a good idea! (though the question arises, can the staff be used to go over level 10?)

Also, I like the idea of the forgers becoming the magic item. Maybe the champion's head (already present) can be made free, but require the forger's life? The possibilities are monumental...

[Tortanick]

About the magic items debate, I do agree that for technical reasons they should be identicle, but random stats for troops commanders and items would be nice.

However magic drain scale was mentioned, why not have that affect magic items but on a current province level, not a home province level

[OG_Gleep]

NTJedi said:

It's the same as you saying that elves are 100feet tall with glowing pink noses... you have zero history to backup your statement.

I've tried to be really nice about this, as if I were looking to mock you I couldn't have written better responces myself. Of course I do, as my point is that fiction is ficiton. Its not based in reality. My backup is every book in Borders in the science fiction section.

If you can show me, one instance where a real elf isn't 100ft tall with glowing pink noses I'll shut up and apologize. (actually I do remember reading one story where the elves were extinct giants...but I don't think they had pink glowing noses)

Theres no such thing as unrealistic fantasy. Its whatever the author wants it to be.

About the magic items debate, I do agree that for technical reasons they should be identicle, but random stats for troops commanders and items would be nice

There is nothing wrong with that. But to say it doesn't make sense is pretty silly. And to try and backup with real world facts is even more silly. This isn't Rome Total Realism, where backup to arguments over units and such fits. This is a fantasy game. You can buy that we can sacrafice virgins for units, turn gems into mythical creatures, create magic items but ........

[NTJedi]

OG_Gleep said:
Of course I do, as my point is that fiction is ficiton. Its not based in reality. My backup is every book in Borders in the science fiction section.

Wrong... those books do NOT say all swords are perfectly equal or any item of the such without a reason. Even in D&D you can find weapons of varying types. You just can't grasp that what you are saying is UNRealistic fantasy.

OG_Gleep said:
If you can show me, one instance where a real elf isn't 100ft tall with glowing pink noses I'll shut up and apologize.

The point is a statement such as this is UNRealistic fantasy because it contradicts all other fantasy facts about elves. Saying all fire swords are perfect duplicates without any reason is the same as me writing that anytime OG_Gleep plays a nation in Dominions his troops are all bald and without teeth.

OG_Gleep said:
Theres no such thing as unrealistic fantasy.

Realistic fantasy is as simple as saying wizards use magic.
UNRealistic fantasy is as simple as saying wizards only melee fight in battle.
Sorry you can't grasp this.

OG_Gleep said:
You can buy that we can sacrafice virgins for units, turn gems into mythical creatures, create magic items but ........

Yes, each example you listed can be backed up by fantasy lore unlike your belief in all enchanted spears being perfect duplicates. As explained earlier the identical enchanted spears within Dominions is done because it simplifies programming and reduces micromanagement.

[Graeme Dice]

NTJedi said:
The point is a statement such as this is UNRealistic fantasy because it contradicts all other fantasy facts about elves.

This sentence is so hilariousy stupid that I can't believe any person of normal intelligence would post it. There are no fantasy "facts" about elves. There are standard fantasy _conventions_ about elves, not facts.

UNRealistic fantasy is as simple as saying wizards only melee fight in battle.

Perhaps you should go back in time and tell that to Tolkien. After all, he isn't being "realistic" by giving Gandalf the most powerful sword of any of the members of the fellowship. A sword that Gandalf uses to fight instead of casting spells.