OT: a nice RPG-ish game?

[Lex]

wow.. Vampires The Masquerade really was a great game! too bad I never played it

That was one of the first games that really let you be a DM in multiplayer. I waited and waited for my buddies to get the game, but it never happened.

[Lex]

tinkthank said:
- Pool of Radiance (ouch, the memory pains me)

HAHA funny story: I followed the development of the game up until its release, then got it the day it came out. Except I got caught in unexpected overtime at work for a few weeks, and by the time I sat down to play Pool of Radiance, I read the review about how disappointing, and put it right back on my shelf. Same thing happened with Master of Orion3. I tracked the game all through development, then bought it the first few days it came out. Except that time I got a copy for my friend as a belated-birthday present. Again I got caught up with work, and when I got the news that it was terrible, I was saved yet again!

Moral of this story: you can always count on work to save you from bad games. (oh, and read reviews before buying games)

[Thufir]

Kel said:
I only have one to add that hasn't been mentioned:
Wizardry 7-8

I thought Wizardry 8 was awesome. I don't recall whether the storyline really grabbed me, but I thought that the tactical implementation was the best I ever played.

[Boron]

Lex said:

HAHA funny story: I followed the development of the game up until its release, then got it the day it came out. Except I got caught in unexpected overtime at work for a few weeks, and by the time I sat down to play Pool of Radiance, I read the review about how disappointing, and put it right back on my shelf. Same thing happened with Master of Orion3. I tracked the game all through development, then bought it the first few days it came out. Except that time I got a copy for my friend as a belated-birthday present. Again I got caught up with work, and when I got the news that it was terrible, I was saved yet again!

Moral of this story: you can always count on work to save you from bad games. (oh, and read reviews before buying games)

thats what happened to me especially with warcraft 3 .
i was such a huge blizzard fan because of Starcraft/Diablo 2 LoD that i bought warcraft 3 blindly .

you can never trust though reviews at least not the ones from the pc magazines like gamestar or pc games which are sold . especially games from big companies like C&C 3 or Warcraft 3 got hyped and scores of 85+% in all big magazines but only because Westwood/Blizzard made them .
If a small not well known software company would have made the same game i am sure they would have rated it something like 60-80% .

[Lex]

well, noone would dare muddy Blizzard's perfect record. They've produced ONLY bestseller games so far. Which, btw, where is World Of Warcraft? I've been holding off from playing MMORPGs for the same reasons I don't snort coke (cos the icecubes gets stuck in my nose), but I think I might actually try this one when it comes out (if it ever comes out)

[deccan]

Lex said:
if you're a game collector, you might want to track down some of the classic Ultimas.. or Bard's Tale.. oh, if we're gonna go down memory lane, Betrayal At Krondor still holds a place in my heart.

One word: Darklands.

[Stormbinder]

tinkthank said:
Hello, thought I'd ask here, cant find the thread which dealt with this topic before, so I'll post anew and try to be specific:
Anybody have a nice tip for me regarding a good SP RPG kind of a game, can but does not have to be fantasy setting, can but does not have to be hack-n-slashy, can involve lots of strategy/tactics and group control, can but does not have to be newer than 3 years old? I am looking for a good present for someone, but dont know enough about where to look.
These ones I tried and liked very much, something along these lines:
- Baldur's gate series (good story, chars, sound, gameplay)
- Planescape: Torment (great story, great atmosphere)
- Fallout series (story, flexibility, gameplay too to a lesser degree, humor)
- Arcanum (idea, story, details, humor)
- Deus Ex original (a game made with love for detail)
- Thief II (gripping and well done, although not really an RPG)

These I found much less enticing, or downright bad:
- Icewind Dale (bored me, never got far)
- Morrowind (good idea which became stale fast; all NPCs just stood around waiting to be robbed)
- Neverwinter Nights (great tool for modders/MP, but a hastily shod-together dungeon crawl which was boring as hell SP)
- Pool of Radiance (ouch, the memory pains me)

Thanks much for your tips.

LOL Tinkthank!

I am avid RPG gamer myself - it is by far my favorite genre in computer games (wargaming/strategy gaming only comes as distant second ). I also have a lot of experience with pen and paper games, have been creating a large compaigns of my own and DM-ing them in my school and college years. Finally I think I can safely say (and I hope it will not sound too arrogant) that I've probably played 95+% of all PRGs worth playing that were created in the Last 15+ years, no matter which public or privite "Hall of RPG Fame" you will take.

What is more relivent to you though, is that my own personal "Hall Of Fame" of RPG genre is exactly correlates with the games that you "liked very much". (meaning mine includes all the games in your list) Except perhaps Thief2, which is a nice game but not really a RPG, as you said yourself. What even more (and perhaps more important), is that your list of "bad" or "not exciting" RPGs exactly correlates with mine also.



And I am talking *both* titles of the games and the reasons why you liked/disliked them.

In my expereince it is very rare when you meet a person with so similar tastes and attitide toward RPGs. So I hope my future advice will be valuable to you, since it looks like our tastes in RPG are extemely similar...

Here are few more RPGs that occupy first 10 or so positions in my mental computer RPG HOF, in adition to the excellent games you have mentioned. I'll write very brief review for each of these games, to help you to make up your mind which one to choose, although you'll probably love all of them.

Frankly I would never bother with all this, but as I said the your two game lists with comments that you have posted were so similar to mine, that I feel I should do it for a fellow RPG player.



1. Wizardry 8 One of the best RPG character development system I ever encountered in computer game. Very stylish game. Excellent and very deep 3D turn-based combat system. Excellent story, constant multiply choices thoughtout the game, multiply endings. Superb voice acting. Good graphic, for an RPG. A lot of humor. Tons of small details and the game clearly was a labor of love for its authors (Last game Sirtech produced just before filing for bankropcy)


(Just a small example on in game humor, try to select "mad wizard" personality for one of your characters. (you characters talk to you and to each other all the time, like in Baldur Games game) Than kill him and ressurect him after the battle. All personalities have different things to say in such situation (usually asking you NOT to do it again, or something along this lines ). That one persanality says in high-pitched kindof insane voice "...And a big "HELLO-O-O!!!" from all your dead relatives!!!...". You should hear it, it still cracnks me up when I hear that voice saying it. It is just a small and insignificant detail of course but the game is choke full of it. I suggest you to run and buy this game right now, you'll love it.



1.a Wizardy 7 was also great game, if you can tolerate early 90-ies graphic. (although it was surprisingly good for its time). Even larger gameworld than Wiz7. More challenging too, for the most part. If you want to play both start with Wiz 7, becayuse the are soem story elements that tie these games togetehr. Although if you have no stomach for more primitive graphics of Wiz7, you can easely start with Wiz8, you'll not lose too much of a story. But whatever you do avoid "improved" remake of Wizardry 7 Gold - it suck.




2. Betrayal in Krondor . Graphic is relatively primitive, but the game is amazing. It is the only computer RPG game in existance AFAICT whose story was created by famous fantasy author(Feist). He wrote story, dialogs, item description, everything, and man, do you feel the difference! Great book-quality story, very good combat system, excellent puzzles and riddles. Primitive graphic though, but if you like me in this regard you'll never notice it. Try to get CD Version of this game with digital voice acting and CD music. The pure "quality" of writing is the best from all RPGs I've ever seen.



3. System Shock 2 This game is actually half RPG half 1st person shooter a la Deus Ex (but with more RPG elements that Deus Ex). There is one major warning about this game though. This game will scare you ****less. And I mean it.


When you'll play it, do it with 4 speakers for 3D sound (the game makes great use of it, best sound/efects from any RPG game so far), with lights turned off. But make sure than when/if you scream you'll not wake your mate/neigbors. Yes, it is that scary, and I am not easely scared, trust me. (I usually fall asleep during the "horror" moovies, just to give you example )

Excellent Character Development system (quite similar to Deus Ex, but a bit deeper). Very good story. Fantastic atmosphere. If you liked Deus Ex go and buy this one, you'll love it.

Oh, and did I mentioned it is very scary???




4. Jagged Alliance 2 More like half strategy/half RPG hybrid, made by the same company which made Wiz7/8. The best part (and the main part) of the game is definetly tactical level turn based combat, a la UFO1/2/3 but much deeper, and flawlessly executed. Very funny game. Excellent voice acting. The story is not very deep though, but on the other hand it never intended to be. Still excellent game though, if you like strategy/RPG hybrids.




Few more recent RPGs:


5. Knights of the Old Republic. Was created by company which made Baldur's Gates seria. Personally I think this game has some small drawbacks, but it is certanly very good game nevertheless, I liked it a lot.


6. Temple Of Elemental Evil. From the creators of Arcanum (and Fallout) games. The best D&D-based combat implementation in computer game, ever, since the early days of Golden Box seria 20 years ago (3rd edition D&D rulles really shine in this game and make a huge difference). Combat is one of the best in any computer RPG so far. Unfortunately there is not much of the story, and this is the game major disadvantage in my opinion. The game is am exact opposite of Arcanum, and all Arcanum fans and TOEE fans (and devs themself ) agree that if you take deep story and background from Arcanum and combine it with Temple Of Elementaa Evil brilliant combat system (which unfortunately sucked in Arcanum), you will have THE perfect PRG. BTW devs are promising to do it right 3rd time though, we shall see... Anyway, very good PRG if you are looking for fun and challenging combat and is willing to overlook lack of the deep story. But make sure that you'll patch it (there were several offical and none official patches, best to apply them all, since the initial release was quite buggy. With patches the game is runing fine though)




Pheeew. All right, I think that should Last you for quite a while. There are few more excellent RPG games, but I think this is enough for now, since most of these games are quite long.

I hope this information was usefull for you Tinkthank, as well for any otehr RPG lover with similar tastes, if they exist on this board. Have fun!

Regards,
Stormbinder

[Kristoffer O]

Karacan said:

For the "I don't care about graphics at all"-crowd, there's Spiderweb's Avernum series. Very good stories, and Avernum III is huge.

Avernum III (or Exile III as it was called before the interface was remade) is a very good game. Original setting. The mood/setting is great and the world is huge with lots of little stories and adventures besides the grand plotline.

Spiderweb is an indie developer like us. Do not hesitate to aid them

[Esben Mose Hansen]

Yeah, Wizardry 8 is one of the greatest CRPG --- though there is a lot of combat (not pertaining to the story, just a lot of monsters to deal with).

From the really old school there is Might&Magic 6,7 and 8 (6 was better than 7 which was better than 8). Don't buy 9.

[Alneyan]

deccan said:
One word: Darklands.

Concured with. If you can find it and run it, Darklands. It will unlikely be anyone's cup of tea, but it is worth a look, and definitively more than that (it came out in 1992 if memory serves). Do not forget to patch this game though, or else you will be totemised.

Daggerfall might catch your fancy as well, if you don't mind its graphics, and its lack of variety after some time of playing. Daggerfall is closer to a love-hate game; there are worshippers of this game, and others burnt it. Ah, if only Morrowind had been just Daggerfall with an editor to add more randomness and variety... Like above, make sure you have the latest patch, which irons out almost all bugs from the game (you can still experience many crashes though, but if you are lucky, it might actually work well under XP).

Besides this, may I suggest both Ultima VII, and especially Serpent's Isle? They are easy to run on modern computers; a programme has been made for this purpose, as the games were unplayable on most computers. So, if you want to play them, be sure to download Exult there.

Lastly, I don't know if you fancy such games, but roguelikes may interest you (such as Nethack, Angband and its variants, or ADOM). Their graphics are fairly... erh... rudimentary, and the interfance can be cumbersome to learn if you hate keyboard shortcuts. There are also two graphical Versions of roguelikes, with decent graphics and a nicer interface:
- Falcon's Eye for Nethack.
- AngbandTK and ZangbandTK for Angband. I am not sure if I can post the link to these though; while they are perfectly legal, the easiest Version to use is hosted on an abandonware site, which may or may not be fine with our Moderators.

On another note, as you seem to like dialogues (Planescape Torment), may I suggest the Discworld series? These are adventure games instead, but I cannot think of any other RPG with dialogues such as Planescape.

Edit: I knew I had forgotten something. Albion. It is a somewhat old game (1996 if memory serves, so it isn't that old), and that can even run well on modern computers, with enticing graphics. Its setting is quite unique, and it could be said to be somewhat an RPG. Or, on the topic of such atmospheric games, Omikron (or The Nomad Soul as it is known in some countries) might interest you. It is a hybrid game with adventure elements, some action (thrown in at the request of Eidos, the editor) and a drop of RPG. Its main strength is its atmosphere as well, although the core of the plot feels quite cliché after a while.