Endgame Diversity Mod - v1.2 released

[Aethyr]

Originally Posted by LDiCesare

Did you actually use them in some game? Did they perform well? Were they cost-effective? How do you feel that they can't swim? Did you try to send some of them underwater just to see how they crawl down there to the point of being unable to even reach their opponent before routing and dying?

I've used them to great effect, but I have not tried to take them underwater. Are your statements based on how the unit performs in general or *only* how it performs underwater?

[Kheldron]

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

Kheldron, you got me all excited about a big showdown for this Inversions turn! And then... nothing! I'll tell you where you can put that Kraken!

At the time I wrote that I was going to try to break that siege then realized you had more than 50% chance to put my kraken where you suggest with your southern reinforcements. I'll come back when I have better control of his final destination

[LDiCesare]

I've used them to great effect, but I have not tried to take them underwater. Are your statements based on how the unit performs in general or *only* how it performs underwater?

My statements are based on how they are worthless underwater and therefore spending water gems on these instead of something worth going under the waves is questionable at best.
Sure, on land they are great. But many other summons are great on land too, and not necessarily as expensive.
If you play a land-only game, they are certainly good.
If there are underwater nations, then you should not waste water gems on them imo.

[pyg]

Originally Posted by Gregstrom

People took Socrates seriously, and he only had to poison himself once! If you do it on a monthly basis, it's a guaranteed way to get worshipped as a living deity.

I used to poison myself almost daily and managed to attract followers with almost every poisoning, sometimes even more than one at a time.

[Lingchih]

Originally Posted by LDiCesare

And please don't insult people.

"Stupid" is actually a term of endearment that I occasionally use

And yes, I was speaking of them on land. They should not go into the water, which is sad. It seems thematic for them. I really wish they had the amphibious tag.

[LDiCesare]

"Stupid" is actually a term of endearment that I occasionally use

Sorry, this was not obvious. A smiley then would have helped.

Yes, they are great on land, but given the water gems cost, I have a real issue about summoning them versus using the water gems for something else.
If underwater is not an issue, then they are great.
If water nations exist, I feel the mod overall makes it even harder to get down there, due to krakens on the one side, which are way easier to spam for water nations than land nations, and grendelkins on the other, which are going to disrupt your spending of water gems towards something that's mostly useless underwater.

[nosre]

Hi. I'm pretty new to this game and therefore play mostly single player, and "Endgame Diversity Mod" showing up all the time in my EA games is pretty annoying. Is there any way to disable the nation? I love the actual units.

Thanks

[Aethyr]

There are probaly other ways, but I always just select the nations that I will be playing against and avoid any having "random" nations. Hope this helps.

[Fantomen]

Originally Posted by nosre

Hi. I'm pretty new to this game and therefore play mostly single player, and "Endgame Diversity Mod" showing up all the time in my EA games is pretty annoying. Is there any way to disable the nation? I love the actual units.

Thanks

Open the mod in a text editor, then delete this part:

#selectnation 93 -- Dud nation used to give non-pretenders to as a pretender chassis.
#end

#selectnation 92
#era 1
#clearnation
#clearsites
#startfort 4
#name "Endgame Diversity Mod"
#epithet "Testing Nation"
#descr "A nation with all the Endgame Diversity Mod summons available as recruitables."
#summary "May be useful for testing the summons without having to build up powerful magic to summon them."
#brief "Nation able to recruit the Endgame Diversity Mod summons."
#addreccom 2985 -- Roc
#addreccom 2951 -- Grendelkin
#addreccom 2952 -- Treant
#addreccom 2956 -- True Firebird
#addreccom 2957 -- Zmey
#addreccom 2963 -- Ember Lord
#addreccom 2964 -- Great Kraken
#addreccom 2965 -- Shishi (Male)
#addreccom 2966 -- Shishi (Female)
#addreccom 2967 -- Asynja
#addreccom 2968 -- Wild Ettin
#addreccom 2969 -- Mechanical Giant
#addreccom 2970 -- Wendigo
#addreccom 2984 -- Cyclops
#startcom 2970 - Give a wendigo and a grendelkin as starting commanders.
#startscout 2951
#end

[Squirrelloid]

Ok, having played with various versions at this point, some thoughts:

Grendelkin did not need to be nerfed. Without magic they aren't good for much beyond anti-thug/SC duty or army assistance. The rather high strength they started with (45) was the only thing that made them interesting at all - nerfing this has reduced any desire on my part to summon them.

Rocs in their current incarnation are basically useless except as gatecleavers. And they're more expensive than gate cleavers. Nor are they really more mobile than gate cleavers, since a gatecleaver can 'teleport' through a lab to a unit much farther away than 5 provinces. Strongly recommend re-instituting A3.

Haven't been notably impressed with Shishi, but i don't think i've seen them used well yet. I have seen a lot of them, but they mostly just died =)

Ember Lords are pretty awesome, but I'm not convinced they're overpowered yet. Hard to use frequently because of cost.

The firebird definitely needs to be no earlier than Conj 6, auto-casting solar brilliance is really powerful. I might move it to conj 7.

No opinion on summons which require nature gems - N is too valuable to use for them for any nation i've used with EDM summons.

Older cyclops version was much better (E4 + random), as it actually allows access to E5 rituals with boots, which gives you a real reason to summon them. The newer version is far less useful, and not really worth the 30e in most circumstances. If you can't get more E than a Troll King, its simply not worth it, since the King is so much easier to summon (path requirement wise).

I don't remember when Asynja changed. The version that was used in CPF3 seemed perfectly useful.

None of these really reduce the demand for tarts, because tarts are still the best way to get magic diversity. Undoing the nerfs which stop the new summons from being useful for magic diversity is necessary, and even then tarts are still the best access to diverse magic. May need some other summons purely focused on providing magic diversity to actually compete.