Star Wars Mod - II (Sci-Fi Xover Mod)

[Andrés]

I knew about the crew quarters, I had added them when I copied the vehicle size and didn't notice the error.
I have already added a small cargo container, so you'll be able to carry troops anyway.
I made droid quarters that are CQ and LS but have to hit penalties.

I didn't know about the 0 damage thing, but most components have the same tonnage and tonnage structure, I see no problem in adding them.
Also your mechanized troops and weapons look terribly small and weak when compared to standard techs. Do we want all troops to be tiny and weak?

[Phoenix-D]

"I thought about that, but then what's to stop the Empire from using it (and saving 10kt) on all of its other hull sizes"

Add another CQ requirment to everything else; problem solved.

[Erax]

My playtest game has progressed to the point where I could actually invade a planet, and I've discovered that the stuff I've posted has a few bugs.

The Assault Shuttle hull had a 0 crew quarters requirement, but this had some weird effects: the ship can be built with no CQ, but moves at 1/2 speed (I guess the code that gives ships penalties for battle damage is doing this). If you do give this Shuttle hull a CQ, then it moves faster than it's supposed to.

This means we're back to a 1 minimum CQ requirement for the Assault Shuttle, which in turn means I have to design a 10-kt 'passenger quarters' component so the Shuttle can actually be used to carry something. It could also be a 20-kt 'shuttle cargo bay' that acts as crew quarters too but is less efficient than standard cargo bays, so you'd use them only in small hulls... hmmm... I'll think about it and post the whole cargo thing later.

The other bug is with the troop weapons - I gave infantry weapons 0kt of structure (they're supposed to be weapons, not armor), but when I invaded a planet with 50 Naval Troopers armed with bLaster pistols I got a 'division by zero' error which locked the game. I guess troops can't have a structure of 0 - how obvious.

Here are the corrected values for troop weapon structure :

BLaster Pistol - 1kt
BLaster Rifle - 1kt
Light Repeating BLaster - 1kt
Heavy Repeating bLaster - 2kt
Light BLaster Cannon - 3kt
Heavy BLaster Cannon - 6kt
Dual Light BLaster Cannon - 6kt
Dual Heavy BLaster Cannon - 12kt

I'll let you know if any other bugs come up.

[Erax]

Originally posted by Andr&eacutes Lescano:
I didn't know about the 0 damage thing, but most components have the same tonnage and tonnage structure, I see no problem in adding them.
Also your mechanized troops and weapons look terribly small and weak when compared to standard techs. Do we want all troops to be tiny and weak?

I scaled them so that the AT-AT was as large as a SE IV large troop (20 kt). This equates things at the top end, but perhaps the other SW vehicles do become 'tiny and weak' as a result. Maybe the AT-AT should be 30kt ?

As for weapons, I started with the bLaster pistol having a damage of 1 and 'built up' from there. If you want SW troop weapons to be comparable to SE IV troop weapons, all of their damage values will have to be multiplied by about 2.5.

As a note of interest, 100 light infantry with bLaster pistols (in two waves of 50) were able to defeat 3 planetary militia with 40% losses in my playtest game.

[Erax]

As for weapons, I started with the bLaster pistol having a damage of 1 and 'built up' from there. If you want SW troop weapons to be comparable to SE IV troop weapons, all of their damage values will have to be multiplied by about 2.5.

OK, I compared damage/kt ratios for SW and a few SE IV troop weapons and here's what I came up with :

G.Cannon I - 3.33
G.Cannon II - 5.00
G.Cannon III - 6.67
Small DUC I - 1.67
Small DUC II - 3.33
Small DUC III - 5.00
Small APB I - 2.00 (range 1)
Small APB II - 3.00 (range 1)
Small APB III - 4.00 (range 1)

Pistol - 1.00
Rifle - 1.00
Lt Rpt - 2.00
Hv Rpt - 2.00
Lt Cannon - 2.00
Hv Cannon - 2.17
Dual Lt Cannon - 2.40
Dual Hv Cannon - 2.60

If we want SW troop weapons to be on the same scale as their SE IV counterparts, their damage values can be revised as follows (with the resulting damage/kt ratios in parentheses):

Pistol - 2 (2.00)
Rifle - 3/3 (3.00)
Lt Rpt - 4/4 (4.00)
Hv Rpt - 10/10 (5.00)
Lt Cannon - 16/16/16 (5.33)
Hv Cannon - 34/34/34 (5.67)
Dual Lt Cannon - 32/32/32 (6.40)
Dual Hv Cannon - 68/68/68 (6.80)

As a positive side effect, there is now a greater difference between the various infantry weapons. I reduced the heavy repeating bLaster's range by 1 so that now only bLaster cannon have a range of 3.

My stats for cargo bays and boarding parties are almost done - will post them here soon.

[Erax]

OK, here are the stats for stormtrooper boarding parties and cargo bays for SW ships. I designed the stormtroopers to be slightly more efficient than SE IV space marines and the cargo bays to be a good deal less efficient (for some reason I feel SW ships are less cargo-efficient than standard SE IV ships):

Name := Stormtrooper Boarding Parties I/II/III/IV/V
Description := Imperial stormtroopers trained in boarding enemy ships and taking them over. Boarding parties can only capture ships which have no shields remaining.
Pic Num := 65
Tonnage Space Taken := 10
Tonnage Structure := 10
Cost Minerals := 200/250/300/350/400
Cost Organics := 0
Cost Radioactives := 0
Vehicle Type := Ship\Base
Supply Amount Used := 5
Restrictions := None
General Group := Weapons
Family := 2460
Roman Numeral := 1/2/3/4/5
Custom Group := 0
Number of Tech Req := 3
Tech Area Req 1 := Ship Capture
Tech Level Req 1 := 1/2/3/4/5
Tech Area Req 2 := Imperial Ship Construction
Tech Level Req 2 := 1
Tech Area Req 3 := Troops
Tech Level Req 3 := 2
Number of Abilities := 2
Ability 1 Type := Boarding Attack
Ability 1 Descr := Provides 3/6/9/12/15 stormtrooper sections for boarding combat (all boarding parties on ship can be used for attack or defense).
Ability 1 Val 1 := 3/6/9/12/15
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0
Ability 2 Type := Cargo Storage
Ability 2 Descr := Provides 6/12/18/24/30kT worth of cargo space.
Ability 2 Val 1 := 6/12/18/24/30
Ability 2 Val 2 := 0
Weapon Type := None

Name := Cargo Bay I/II/III
Description := Area on a starship where cargo can be housed.
Pic Num := 269
Tonnage Space Taken := 20
Tonnage Structure := 20
Cost Minerals := 120
Cost Organics := 0
Cost Radioactives := 0
Vehicle Type := Ship\Base
Supply Amount Used := 0
Restrictions := None
General Group := Cargo
Family := 9
Roman Numeral := 1/2/3
Custom Group := 0
Number of Tech Req := 2
Tech Area Req 1 := Cargo
Tech Level Req 1 := 1/2/3
Tech Area Req 2 := Star Wars Technology
Tech Level Req 2 := 1
Number of Abilities := 1
Ability 1 Type := Cargo Storage
Ability 1 Descr := Provides 50/100/150kT worth of cargo space.
Ability 1 Val 1 := 50/100/150
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0
Weapon Type := None

Name := Small Cargo Bay
Description := Area on a starship where small amounts of cargo can be housed.
Pic Num := 269
Tonnage Space Taken := 10
Tonnage Structure := 10
Cost Minerals := 50
Cost Organics := 0
Cost Radioactives := 0
Vehicle Type := Ship\Base
Supply Amount Used := 0
Restrictions := None
General Group := Cargo
Family := 9
Roman Numeral := 0
Custom Group := 0
Number of Tech Req := 2
Tech Area Req 1 := Cargo
Tech Level Req 1 := 1
Tech Area Req 2 := Star Wars Technology
Tech Level Req 2 := 1
Number of Abilities := 1
Ability 1 Type := Cargo Storage
Ability 1 Descr := Provides 20kT worth of cargo space.
Ability 1 Val 1 := 20
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0
Weapon Type := None

Name := Massive Cargo Bay I/II/III
Description := Massive area on a starship where cargo can be housed.
Pic Num := 269
Tonnage Space Taken := 360
Tonnage Structure := 360
Cost Minerals := 2160
Cost Organics := 0
Cost Radioactives := 0
Vehicle Type := Ship\Base
Supply Amount Used := 0
Restrictions := None
General Group := Cargo
Family := 9
Roman Numeral := 1/2/3
Custom Group := 0
Number of Tech Req := 3
Tech Area Req 1 := Cargo
Tech Level Req 1 := 1/2/3
Tech Area Req 2 := Large Scale Construction
Tech Level Req 2 := 1/2/3
Tech Area Req 3 := Star Wars Technology
Tech Level Req 3 := 1
Number of Abilities := 1
Ability 1 Type := Cargo Storage
Ability 1 Descr := Provides 1250/2500/3750kT worth of cargo space.
Ability 1 Val 1 := 1250/2500/3750
Ability 1 Val 2 := 0
Weapon Type := None

I have the cargo/kt and cargo/mineral cost efficiency figures for all SW cargo components & can post them if anyone's interested.

Hope it helps.

[Andrés]

Just uploaded new files:
Sci-Fi Crossover Mod Homepage
(Note that I didn't bother to change anything in the html, but I the "Datafiles" and "Xls'" zips are new)

I made the change in the shape of the tech tree, there are very few "new" tech areas, but most of the standard ones give new stuff, that should make trade and tech capture easier.

Also added a lot of new things including most of Erax's contributions.
Most Imperial and a good part of the Rebel are done, soon I want to move on into some of the other starwars races.

I'm still adding new stuff, making changes and correcting mistakes.
But I decided to upload the "Last Version" (and try to keep doing that periodiacally) so we don't end up talking about different things.

Take a try and let me know what you think.

[ October 14, 2002, 04:51: Message edited by: Andr&eacutes Lescano ]

[jimbob]

Erax:

First, great work. That's a lot of work, and it's well balanced with the SEIV generic game. I was just wondering about this:

I scaled them so that the AT-AT was as large as a SE IV large troop (20 kt). This equates things at the top end, but perhaps the other SW vehicles do become 'tiny and weak' as a result. Maybe the AT-AT should be 30kt?

Because the Star Trek Empire is a racial trait, it would be okay for it to have some advantages over the SEIV generic game. Perhaps the AT-ST could be equiv. to the SEIV large troop and then yes, bump up the AT-ATs to 30, even 35 kT. If balance is really an issue, which I don't think it will be, just bump up the racial trait cost a tad.

Just my .02$Cdn.

[Erax]

Originally posted by jimbob:
Erax:

First, great work. That's a lot of work, and it's well balanced with the SEIV generic game. I was just wondering about this: (quote deleted)
Because the Star Trek Empire is a racial trait, it would be okay for it to have some advantages over the SEIV generic game. Perhaps the AT-ST could be equiv. to the SEIV large troop and then yes, bump up the AT-ATs to 30, even 35 kT. If balance is really an issue, which I don't think it will be, just bump up the racial trait cost a tad.

Just my .02$Cdn.

Thanks, but it isn't work when I'm having fun.
About the vehicle sizes, my main concern is that they must 'feel right' for everyone (balance issues can be fixed easily, as you said). Nobody knows how big an SE IV troop is supposed to be, so we can just pick a size for the AT-AT that 'feels right' for everyone and then adjust all the other SW vehicles so they stay in scale - if 30kt seems like a good figure for the AT-AT, then the AT-ST goes from 10kt to 15kt.

I'm out of ideas for now, so I guess I'll just play SW-SE IV for a while to get some new ones. Andrés, you're the man, let me know if you need any help.

[Andrés]

Originally posted by jimbob:

Because the Star Trek Empire is a racial trait, it would be okay for it to have some advantages over the SEIV generic game.

And what's the Star Trek Empire anyway??? The Romulans?? The Klingon???

Anyway most racial traits cost 0 and must be choosen in order to play the right race.
When you choose "Star Wars" and "Imperial Technologies", you MUST NOT choose "Standard SE4".
Choosing a bad combination will lead to unexpected results and will most like be considered cheating.