Seeking MP Serpent Cult Advice

[VedalkenBear]

Mathu has a point... that would be SCARY if whoever killed a head got cursed.

And I suggested a W9 bless because I thought the Quickness you got made you move farther. Thus, your hydras get into combat quicker.

As for the Theurgs not being Poison-immune, you can give them Poison Rings or Birch Boots + some other random item that gives Poison Resistance.

And don't call the heretics useless. You just don't use them inside your own dominion. Dominion scales don't change unless there is dominion of some sort in the province that is different than the prevailing conditions (AFAIK). Therefore, the heretics lower dominion to 0, and 'freeze' the dominion scales in place. Now, if you're attacking the opponent, you have the heretics play 'dominion clean-up' and then move them out so that your own dominion can take hold.

They are an offensive weapon, not a defensive weapon. Has anyone tried to put an idol on them to see if they go up to Heretic 5 or 6? IIRC, Heretic 6 would be a 100% chance to reduce dominion every turn.

And I do find Hydras 'great but expensive'. Just like every other unit/spell/item in this game, you need to know how to use them.

[Ironhawk]

Heretics will reduce good scales (Order, Prod, Luck, Magic) but not bad ones. So if your nation has a mix of good and bad and have heretics reducing your dominion then you will be left with only bad scales. Was really amazed when I found this. I thought that heretics acted like a Stone Idol, where they just totally reduced all dominion in a prov, good and bad.

thejeff said:
I'm not sure what you mean by "only reduce beneficial friendly dominion"?

[VedalkenBear]

Ironhawk: Heretics might have effects on good scales, but that is not their function. Their function is to lower the dominion rating as a whole. I have not noticed anything about Heretics changing the actual scales of a province they are in, and I generally play with very good scales.

[Ironhawk]

Vedalken - yeah W9 looks like a good idea on paper. But the speed increase is marginal (from 7 to 10) and the extra attacks from quickness only really helps when your hydra has 1-2 heads left.

I did notice tho that Serpent Priests (the main la pyth mage) do get an astral random, so thats pretty sweet actually. Since they are custom made to bless your hydras in the first place, now they can also etherealize them.

No, heretics really are useless. You say they are good for dominion cleanup - but there are plenty of other things that are better. Temples. Prophets. Cheap indy priests that dont kill your dominion. The "value" of heretics is supposedly magical versatility, but honestly I'm not seeing it yet. You get a 1/20 blood pick and an uncommon F2 at the price of magnifying your bad dominion. How can you justify this?

[VedalkenBear]

The Heretics are MUCH faster at cleaning up dominion than temples, prophet, or cheap priests. Heretics don't have to be set to preach, they just move around. Temples can be expensive (and I hear people don't just put them up willy-nilly in MP). You have one prophet. And cheap indy priests are not very useful given the way preaching works.

Consider the simple effect of using heretics to funnel troops (magical or otherwise) to the front line through hostile dominion. Having reread the dominion rules, preaching (which I assume heretics are a form of) doesn't care about your Dominion. Therefore, as the Serpent Cult you can most likely get away with a rather low starting dominion and use your heretics to screen away opponents' dominion.

Heretics have their uses. I am sorry if you are unable to see them.

[Ironhawk]

Hey, another question for you all: Assuming I were to go the ethereal hydra route, for a moment. And keeping in mind the paths that are generally available to LA pyth...

What poison res unit should I use to fill out the ranks of that army?

[quantum_mechani]

Clearly, bog beasts are the superior choice.

[Ironhawk]

LOL

[LDiCesare]

Ironhawk said:
What poison res unit should I use to fill out the ranks of that army?

Your random S Serpent Priests. They are capital only, like the hydras, 100%PR. About one in 4 will be astral endowed, but that's usually enough.
I'd also suggest not buying any troop (but mages) for a few turns before you plan buying hydras, in order to save the upkeep costs. If you have 1000 gold and dom 8, wait till you have 2000 gold to buy 8 hydras in one turn for instance. The upkeep of hydras staying idle in the capital is huge.

[llamabeast]

quantum_mechani, Sombre will love you for that.