Newbish question

[kasnavada]

I think my problem is I have always played Strategic war games that have weapon strength, windage, Terrain ect but I have very little exp with magic (other than neverwinter Nights, Icewind Dale ect and then I still didn't play the Mage).

I think that your questions are very interesting because there is a lot that people on this forum take for granted. Like boosters working only with mages having at least one in the corresponding path.

But what do I DO with the hammer?

Once I Forge it SOMEONE in my army must use it to make it work....right?

Hammer reduces the cost of forging items (as said above). If you've read the different guides you know that labs enable mages to make magic items. Whenever you want to make a magic item, you just pick up the mage with the right bath to forge the item and select it from the list. The right way to use the hammer(s) is therefore to equip it to the mage(s) that makes the most expensive magic item(s) for this current turn. Otherwise it works just like a normal item creation.

Hum, and I have to says something else : when choosing the items the full cost is shown and not the reduced cost. A thristle mace is shown as costing 10 nature gem even if you have the hammer in hand. However, when you "validate" the item (with the hammer in hand), only 7 gems will be deducted from your vaults and not 10.

The same is true of the other 'school' magic site, the reduction in cost is not shown. But it does work.

[Tuidjy]

I think that you are getting bogged down in this forum's terminology (jargon).
Lets try to explain what a few sentances mean...

The dwarven hammer is Construction 4 item that requires Earth 3, and provides
a forge bonus of 25%.

This means it requires Construction 4 to be researched before it can be forged
by a mage with at least three levels in Earth magic. Incidentally, the forging
of this item will use up 15 earth gems, unless you have some forging bonuses.
The forge bonus of 25% means that when you forge other items with a mage that
is wielding the hammer, you will use 25% fewer gems. For example, if you are
forging a hammer with a hammer, you will use only 12 gems. If you have a druid,
with one level of Nature magic, and he is using the hammer to forge an item that
usually requires 5 nature gems, he will need only 3. Note that the druid has
no Earth magic skill, but can still use the hammer.

Ah, anyway... I am not doing too well at writing this post, keep getting
distracted. I am sure by now other people have answered better than I did.

Just a piece of advice - unless you are playing Mictlan, you do not have to
understand blood slaves. Blood magic is an advanced topic, and many really good
players will not touch it, but still do very well.

[GrudgeBringer]

hello....my usual 2 questions a night time!!

1. I have played a number of games in MP that had some form of a 'LUCK' attribute that you could take.

I have noticed that in some games (MOO2 for example)that while it looked like a waste of picks on the surface (and MOST everyone would never pick Luck as it was kinda costly..3 points out of 20.

However, When in the middle and late game you got Commanders wanting to be hired by you with AWESOME game breaking stats...you started to understand why that 'fool' you all where laughing at at the start picked it while he was dismanteling your Starships Fleets.

So I am wondering if the same applies to MP in D3? Are there any benificail reasons to take Luck or even take Misfortune -3?

I know in D3 playing as a Noob (and a dumb one at that)it IS better not to have a bunch of bad things happening to you while your trying to learn.

2. Pretenders
I understand its all about playing style, nation and Era picked ect.


But maybe I am not understanding WHEN and HOW to pick a Pretender for the nation I want to play.

I would usually (in most other strategy games I have played) pick the strongest, meanest, 1 creature wrecking ball I could and sic him on nations close by as soon as I could find them before they became too powerful.

It seems like in this game I am confused.
I keep finding myself taking a weak pretender (like Arch Mage) that I can take a LOT of good buffs )production, Growth ect)and a LOT of different magic paths so I can research everything (like 4 air, 3 earth, 2 fire, 1 astral, 1 Nature.

But I read that this is called a rainbow pretender and its not really looked on as a good choice especially in MP.

I guess I have 2 questions on this.

1. Does the magic you pick for your pretender effect your starting priests magic lvl (if you have 3E on pretender does your Priests start with 3 earth Astral 1 ect?
And if not why would I want to pick more than say Earth 6 and fire 3?

And finally are the Buffs (Growth, production ect)Worth taking over magic because with a LOT of pretender choices you can't take a lot of magic AND buffs.

What exactly is considered a good SC and how would you design one (just an example).

Thanks for any help

[Endoperez]

Luck affects events and appearance of national heroes. Events can be good or bad, ranging from few magical gems or few hundred extra gp to 3000 gp, magic item and gems. Bad events range from little extra unrest or destroyed temple to hordes of barbarians or knights attacking one of your provinces.
Some nations have VERY good heroes, and some nations have heroes that are so weak to be almost useless. Sometimes the same nation has both types. Heroes can appear if you have anything but Misfortune 3, but the chances of getting them are much better with Luck.

Because Order scale gives money and makes events less rare, taking Order and Luck together is usually avoided because they don't synergize well. Taking Turmoil and Misfortune together, on the other hand, is VERY bad for you nation and something you shouldn't really even consider. It's usually best to go all out if you take one; Luck 3 allows for some very good events, while Order 3 protects you from bad events so you can probably afford Misfortune 1. Order is better for money, but the gems you get from events tend to really pile up in longer games, and while gold events from Luck 3 aren't as reliable as Order 3 your starting position has more effect on your income than the difference between the two.

[GrudgeBringer]

Thank you, I think I am starting to understand the inner workings of the 'Scales' (which (DUH) I just figured out why they call them scales. I was envisioning 'scales' like on a serpent and it actually came to me in a dream that it was the 'Actual Scales that you choose your buffs with.

Sometime the terminology can throw folks I guess!!

Due to your very ih depth answer I an getting a handle on scales.

What I need to know is this:

Is LUCK as good in MP as it is in solo (some games it isn't like taking the Diplomacy option in solo but in MP has NO relevance (I understand that the race you choose might effect the overall selection), but for the most part is Luck help you starting position in BOTH Solo AND MP?

The one thing that I have been having a LOT of trouble with is Pretenders.

Is it 'Usually' Better to have a weak Rainbow Pretender with lots of scales and magic OR a less diversivied P and have him either devout his picks to either Battle or Magic?

Also does the choosing of say 5 or 6 Dominion help in a MP game ( I'm not really sure yet if it helps in a solo game.

Thanks1!! Getting closed with your help every day!!

[thejeff]

Luck works the same in SP and MP. It's usually considered one of the weaker scales. As your realm gets bigger, later in the game, the number of events (good or bad) is capped, so the advantages of luck doesn't scale with number of provinces the way order and growth can. Most MP players prefer Order 3 and Misfortune 1 or 2. It's a trade off.

5 or 6 dominion is about the minimum I'd use in MP. You can get away with less in SP. 9 or 10 for Awe, or if you're really trying to spread your dominion for some reason. A temperature dependent race (like Neifelheim or Abyssia), nasty dominion effects (like LA Ermor or R'yleh) Immortals?
You want to be fighting in your own dominion as much as you can, especially if you're using your pretender.

The important thing with a pretender is to figure out what you want from him. Rainbows can be useful for getting lots of site searching early on and later for forging and casting rituals. Most would only do this in MP if you have some form of very strong troops to expand with and hold off an initial rush. Elephants would be a good example.

You can also use a pretender for early expansion. If you haven't yet, try an awake Wyrm with no magic, good scales and dominion 9 or 10 for Awe. He should be able to take independents by himself from turn 2. Avoid attacking Knight provinces in low dominion. If he dies, call him back. He's got no magic to lose.
A Prince of Darkness with a few more levels of death can do the same thing, but is a little more fragile until he gets some equipment. Even cheap trinkets make a big difference. Since he has full slots, he can be equipped to stay a threat throughout the game.

I'll often try to design a pretender who can do a little of both. Expand my nation's magic diversity and be able to serve as an SC in the middle game. That depends a lot on what your nation has.

The other main use is to set up a pretender to cast particular late game spells. Wish, Master Enslave, that kind of thing.

[chrispedersen]

For some races, choosing a high dominion is critical.

For example, I prefer starting with Dominions of 7 or so when playing a sacred bless strategy. This ensures that I can produce enough sacred units per turn to form an army.

On some pretenders, for example with fear, I like to play Dom 9 or preferably 10, in order to get the awe effect.

And usually, if I am playing an awake rainbow, I will accept a very low dominion 1-2...and take precautions against dominion death...

[MaxWilson]

Keep in mind, Dexlyn, that if you try the awake Wyrm pretender, even though he has no magic to lose he can still pick up afflictions (although regeneration reduces the chance of afflictions, and coming back from the dead will sometimes heal some afflictions). Another option is to pick an Immortal pretender like Agartha's Risen Oracle, forge some Black Plate Steel Armor immediately, and go conquer some territories. Nearly as quick and fun, and he heals afflictions (Immortals only come back to life in friendly dominion, but they heal afflictions everywhere) and never picks up fatigue from melee--although he lacks regeneration.

-Max

[thejeff]

Be very careful taking 1-2 dominion in MP. You'll need to spend money on temples and priests to preach that you can avoid otherwise. Even so it can lead to an early dominion death if you start near high dominion nations and/or blood sacrificers.

Precautions can help, but you're still very vulnerable.

[Endoperez]

For multiplayer, if you can't take at least 15 provinces by the end of the first year/start of the second spring, take a combat pretender. You can get by with less in optimum circumstances, but if something goes wrong it's good to have a tough pretender.

Also, try combat pretenders until you can build one that can destroy independents, and then consider how you could counter it.