Please Help Me Tune My Man - Page 5

Saber Cherry · #41 December 11th, 2003, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Taqwus:
If memory serves, Mass Protection = Mass Barkskin, and Barkskin only gives a single +1 PROT once above a certain threshold.

Common misperception=)

Barkskin gives 10 natural protection or +1 natural protection, whichever is greater. So units with 0 natural protection and 10 armor protection get 10 natural protection and 10 armor protection, which sum to 18. The forumla:

N=natural, A=armor, T=total

T=(N+A-(N*A/40)), rounded up.

apoger · #42 December 11th, 2003, 08:23 PM

>You forgot that his troops often leave the battle.

I have no idea what this means. A reference to the charmed often perishing due to proximity to the enemy troops?

>Thats why I like rushing for hellbind heart if Im using blood.

Hellbind Heart is also good, and is what you use if you have blood magic. However it requires a blood slave and has a fatigue cost of 100. Not nearly as castable as Charm (no gem cost, 30 fatigue), or even Enslave Mind (no gem cost, 20 fatigue, 100 range!).

LordArioch · #43 December 11th, 2003, 08:37 PM

I would have to agree about mass protection being overlooked...most infantry gain at least +6 prot from it. It raises 15 -> 22 protection if I remember right, and that's by no means a bonus to be overlooked.

Gandalf Parker · #44 December 11th, 2003, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gandalf and replied to by apoger:

quote:
>You forgot that his troops often leave the battle.

I have no idea what this means. A reference to the charmed often perishing due to proximity to the enemy troops?

I like to use mine against commanders. Either with flyers or assassins or by snatching the commanders with whirlwind. Sometimes an enemy commander has 100 troops or an enemy mage has a dozen nasty summons. If you snatch the commander from them then when you attack, those troops rout. Beautiful sight to see.

apoger · #45 December 11th, 2003, 08:48 PM

>Common misperception=)

>Barkskin gives 10 natural protection or +1 natural protection, whichever is greater. So units with 0 natural protection and 10 armor protection get 10 natural protection and 10 armor protection, which sum to 18.

Ah, it's been changed from Dom1. You are quite correct, it's worth casting now since it does offer a hefty armor increase. Glad to see it made useful.

apoger · #46 December 11th, 2003, 08:49 PM

>If you snatch the commander from them then when you attack, those troops rout. Beautiful sight to see.

I see, yes when you are lucky enough to snag a commander it's a wonderful thing.

Kristoffer O · #47 December 11th, 2003, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by apoger:
>Common misperception=)

>Barkskin gives 10 natural protection or +1 natural protection, whichever is greater. So units with 0 natural protection and 10 armor protection get 10 natural protection and 10 armor protection, which sum to 18.

Ah, it's been changed from Dom1. You are quite correct, it's worth casting now since it does offer a hefty armor increase. Glad to see it made useful.

Actually this is the same as in dom1. Mass protection has always been one of the most useful spells.

Jasper · #48 December 11th, 2003, 11:29 PM

Barksin has always been good, and even better on troops with good armor. It only sucks on things that normally have a high natural protection.

Mass Protection is alot of bang for 1 gem, plus the armor benefits can stack with Growing Fury.

Single castings of Protection/Barkskin can also be effective on things like Elephants/Hydra, or Sidhe commanders. In particular the synergy with Regeneration is nice.

In Dom 1 I fairly often would give important armored commanders Barksin amulets, as the extra protection made them much more survivable against mundane troops.

Chris Byler · #49 December 12th, 2003, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Saber Cherry:

quote:
Originally posted by apoger:
>I've forgotten "Mass Protection".

I find it's only really useful when you have a mass of very low protection troops (like maenads). If your army already has good armor the boost is almost nothing.

Ummm... you've tested this? If you have prot-13 HI, as Man often does, the equation is 10+13+(10*13/40)=19.75 (rounds up to 20). 20 protection HI are incredibly good, and that's a hefty +7 bonus. Much more valuable than raising a 0-prot unit up to 10 protection.

Even Ulm benefits. Protection-18 Ulm HI goes to 24, a +6 bonus, as opposed to the +3 bonus from Legions of Steel. Or in addition, if you prefer

-Cherry

Excellent point. Barkskin/MassProt isn't that useful for units with high NATURAL protection (cave drakes, trolls, cyclops, Jotuns?). But it's great for units with high ARMOR protection and little or no natural protection. Protection gives increasing returns against most attacks - after you get above the attacker's str+dam, it becomes increasingly more likely that you won't be damaged at all (below that it just improves the chances of being wounded instead of killed).

Also, magical forms of protection don't reduce your defense or increase your encumbrance like more armor does.