AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

[JLS]

Originally posted by PsychoTechFreak:
All right, I am going to set up a some hundred years batch sim with the 3.02 file today. Standart turn test would be very hard, because at least every single event stops the turn flow, and every single event has to be saved or noted. I think it should not make a difference, but let's see what happens in simultaneous first.

Thanks PFT, there is a good possibility that there is no deference in regards to Events effects, whether you were to play in Simultaneous or Standard mode.
However, it is prudent to at least test to see. There are many areas of se4 that is definitely handled exceedingly different by the engine; in respects to play mode then just the contrasting movement.

[ September 06, 2003, 12:11: Message edited by: JLS ]

[JLS]

Originally posted by oleg:
I saw AI' HW rebelled many, many times. With old file _very_ often, with a new file only very rare. I never had my HW rebelled though.

It is certain SE treats humans and AI HW differently. The disparity in events is just too obvious.

Oleg, can you elaborate a little, I am unsure of your point.

We are happy as far as the new Events file is performing so far, you have made a great contribution.

What are your thoughts on the new file and how it is performing?

[ September 06, 2003, 12:18: Message edited by: JLS ]

[JLS]

Thanks for the file and your help with the mines, Mottlee

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As a result from Mottlees continued help with balancing AIC Minesweeping over the Last few months, there will now be a reductions in the AI minesweeping abilities totaled to be about 30% over all with significant reductions applying to the early and early-mid game.

Furthermore, Please note in AIC v4.0 > The Human Players will now have the ability to destroy mines with Fighter Carriers.
In addition, for all Human Players: Minefields will have NO effect on any BaseShip, Heavy BaseShip or Heavy Carrier class vessel.

Scaled to the respective ships displacements; Dreadnoughts, Battleships, and Battle Cruisers will require MORE mines to damage or destroy Human Player Capital Ships

[ September 06, 2003, 13:01: Message edited by: JLS ]

[mottlee]

Originally posted by JLS:

quote:

---

Originally posted by mottlee:
Expected AI Minesweeping resuts when fleeted for AIC: v4.00.

100+ Scouts (will blow thru a 100 Minefield)
46+ Escorts
46+ Frigates
DD 20
CL 10
CA 4+
BC 3
BB 2+
DN 2
BS 1
Hvy BS 1
---
CVL 2+
CV 1+
Hvy CV 1
=========================
OK I understand that they can/will go through a mine field but not without taking some hits to some ships

Exactly,
If the AI was to enter your 100 minefield with a feet of 99 scouts, as it may be with base se4(ALL 99 AI SHIPS MAY BE LOST)
It would be true with 40 escorts or 40 frigates (ALL AI SHIPS WILL BE LOST)
The same would be true if the AI entered a 100 minefield with 15 destroyers (all destroyers will be lost)

Furthermore if the AI was to enter your 100 mine field with numbers closer to the above chart, for example a fleet of 17 or 18 destroyers many of the AI destroyer will be damaged or destroyed. However, some will get thru.

However, if fleet of 20 or 21 Destroyers was to enter a 100 minefield, then yes all will get thru with little to no damage. Picture it, as total armaments versus the mines if you will

-------------------------------------------------

The same applies to a mixed fleet of 8 Destroyers and 4 Light Cruisers, as it may be with base se4 (ALL SHIPS WILL BE DESTROYED) and this would include all TROOPS on any AI assault ships

If the AI enters a 100 minefield with a fleet of 10 destroyers and 4 Light Cruisers some may get thru but most will be damaged or destroyed and this would include most TROOPS on any AI assault ships

However an AI fleet of 12 destroyers and 5 Light Cruisers will get thru and will maintain the integrity of the troops and there assault ships
=================================================
In short and to recap:

1: Approximately any quantity or make up; at 70% or below the chart all (The AI ships will be lost forever)
2: Approximately any quantity or make up above 70% but less then 100% of the chart (The AI will take damage and destruction, but some AI ships MAY get thru) depending on the proximity to charts 100%.
3: Any quantity or make up above 100% of the chart, the AI will clear the Minefield with little to no damage.


This will also apply for Human Players to some extent with AIC 4.0 at previous post.

With AIC, the closer you reach Baseships and Heavy Carriers >mines are akin to throwing stones at today’s tanks

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So you are telling me there is no part damage in these #'s?...if I go into a 100 ct mine field w/25 battleships there will be no damage????

[oleg]

Not YOU, only players with "AI must take this first " race attribute - AI has an access to special ship hulls with buildin minesweeping ability

Oh, sorry, you refer to possible changes in AIC 4.0 !

I personally do not like it. Any human player who fails to use minesweepers on his ships can as well take AI racial trait

[ September 07, 2003, 10:24: Message edited by: oleg ]

[oleg]

Originally posted by JLS:
Oleg, it would be very helpful if you would answer some of the question the Players and I have been asking you, here and through out the few Last dozen or so Posts in this thread, that are with respect to your statements, when you can find the time.

Please be part of the solution

Respectfully

John

What, I am part of the problem ?

Of course I'll register profound events , like palnets rebellion in my games (with 4.1 file).

[QBrigid]

Originally posted by oleg:
Of course I'll register profound events , like palnets rebellion in my games (with 4.1 file).

Oleg, when you say Rebellion

Please answer this question Oleg are you saying that a Major AI Players Homeworld now becomes another race?

I have NEVER seen this. The AI Players score will drop to nothing and when this happens the HomeWorld was destroyed or Captured.

[QBrigid]

Oleg, can you please clear up these Points , your credibility is at issue, you post inflammatory statements but you have yet made any account for them other then more- inflammatory statements.
You are coming across as though something is personal.


For example: Please look at the intelligent and professional conversation JLS, Fyron, PTF and others had, they all asks a questions and and gave Answers. If some thing was not clear, they further explained THEMSELVES.


With our files now in the order as you suggested, does not the Max Severity options work as you stated, this is our impression?

Have you tested your reformatted file and does the Pre New Game settings react severity levels accordingly?

How about desired Event occurrences; are the Percentages unchanged?

Oleg, can you explain how the percentages work as it is applied to events in lets say game that Last for 500 turns, with AIC events file?

Oleg can you tell me the chance is for a rebellion to be chosen based on AIC 4. event file?

Oleg, you suggested raising "Event Percent Chance Low := 20" is it possible that when players want to play at low they really do not want to play at low?

Also the one AI home world that had this rebellion in your one Neutral test. What was its over all demise?

Oleg, in a test would it not be practical as PTF suggested in his analogy 1 Human 4 or 5 AI?

Are you using all the default and unmodified files AIC?

The way AI Campaigns Event File was always programmed: Is that the odds for ANY Planet or a System to be destroyed in AIC is by far diminished as opposed to Stock se4, and this is good, would you not agree Oleg?

Furthermore, with all the proposed AI Rebellion remedies, it may lesson the total of new Independent Races spawned that enhances Human Player game Play, and this will not be a good thing - Oleg, would it?

Oleg, I have one Last question, when the AI has all as you say "these dome and glom Rebellions" are you able to walk all over the AI in AIC?

Because none of us has ever seen the AI in AIC lay down or its Home world switch to anouter race by an event . In AIC the AI have always been a real challenge.

QBrigid

[ September 07, 2003, 14:12: Message edited by: QBrigid ]

[PvK]

Hmm, the fleet vs. ship minefield argument (that many single ships will die to a minefield, but a fleet will survive) only seems true to me if all of the ships have orders to move specifically into the minefield sector and/or they arrive at the same time. Otherwise, a single ship destroyed by a minefield will create a known minefield marker, which will cause all the other ships to automatically avoid the minefield, unless the race is set to deliberately fly into minefields.

So it is also possible that a fleet will get wiped out by a minefield, when a bunch of smaller ships would only lose one ship. It depends on the situation.

In fact, if you don't have minesweepers, sending a single scout slightly ahead of a fleet can save your fleet from destruction.

PvK

[JLS]

QB, Oleg’s Posts are not inflammatory by nature and I see no problem. However, it would be appropriate if he try to help us understand what he is seeing by addressing our concerns >as well.

My impression, in respect to Oleg's concern with the Rebellion Issue. Is that it could effect the AI Home World in the Medium Category if one was to look at the Events File; I tend to agree with him, as PTF and I was discussing in a earlier post.

I will wait for PTF and the test findings, and this should be sufficient.

We do want Human Player events for the more enjoyable game, but we do not want to burden the Human Player with to many events, also.

Worry not QB, we will find the Balance

[ September 07, 2003, 16:52: Message edited by: JLS ]