CherryMod Thread

What period of Japanese history are you targeting for the majority of the information? Or is it all fantasy based? (I don't mind either way; but the most attractive themes in my mind are those with a little bit of our history mixed in)

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by Zen:
What period of Japanese history are you targeting for the majority of the information? Or is it all fantasy based? (I don't mind either way; but the most attractive themes in my mind are those with a little bit of our history mixed in)

I'm kind of targeting random bits from all periods. The armor styles changed over time, and I don't know which ones had what stats... the books never tell you important stuff like protection values=)

Sometimes swords were dominant, sometimes spears, and I really don't know enough to make a theme for a specific era.

If you know any Japanese mythology, it would be useful for making heroes, national summons, national gods, and national sites. I don't know much about Japanese religion or mythology.

[atul]

Is it so that if you give two weapons to a unit (s)he automatically uses both? If that is the case then here's the nation dedicated to dual-wielding. =) It's just that I've been under impression that in ancient Japan using two swords (long ones, at least) was considered somewhat barbaric. Samurais had katana and short sword, but they weren't used at the same time. Therefore Japan as the nation of dual-wielders strikes me as 'unthematic' (not that it has any relevance to a fantasy setting), but I might very well be wrong. (Of course, for ninjas and ronins everything goes, it's just those samurais with twin katanas...)

While still on that subject, there's this historical figure whose fame was partially owed to the fact he used two swords , Miamoto or something, to succesfully beat a heap of people. Good enough for a hero?

[Hana]

[quote]Originally posted by Saber Cherry:

If you know any Japanese mythology, it would be useful for making heroes, national summons, national gods, and national sites. I don't know much about Japanese religion or mythology.

I like the Japanese theme. I'm reasonably familiar with the mythology, so I'll post a bit of info here. I'm more familiar with the Shinto side of the religion (most Japanese go by a mixture of Buddhist and Shinto beliefs), so the bulk of the info will come from that side.

The two primary Shinto deities are Izanami (female) and Izanagi (male). They were siblings, but also husband and wife. Anyway they created the world, but Izanami ended up dying and going to the underworld after giving birth to one of her children. Izanagi followed her there to take it back, but since she was already decomposing, or according to some accounts she just aged a great deal, she said it was too late and made him leave. The two of them seem to be an embodiment of the yin/yang concept, with Izanami being the yin (feminine/soft/passive/cold/etc.) and Izanagi being the yang (masculine/hard/active/warm/etc). I could easily see them as death and nature oriented pretenders, respectively.

Inari is a rice deity of ambiguous gender. Some of what I've read says female, some says male, so I'm not sure. Inari is very much associated with fox spirits called kitsune, so attracting them may be a possibility for this deity. I recommend this link as a source of kitsune info, and a bit about Inari. The famous kitsune section has a few that might be good as hero units. http://www.comnet.ca/~foxtrot/kitsune/kitsune1.htm

Kappa are sort of bipedal frogs with shells on their backs. They're associated with water (their natural habitat, but they can go on land as well) and it's believed that if they ever dry out they die.

Hannya are the spirits of jealous women who became demons because of their jealousy. They're known to drink blood, particularly from children and infants.

Outside of Shinto beliefs there's a historical figure that ended up rising to legendary status. Minamoto Yo****sune. In short he and his brother Yoritomo were both on the same side of a civil war of a sort. Their side was victorious, but somewhere along the line some animosity built up between the brothers. Yoritomo decided Yo****sune needed to die, and eventually he did. In any case Yo****sune was said to be a very capable fighter and general, and was also said to have been trained by a race of men with some bird-like characteristics (tengu). His consort Shizuka Gozen is quite well known in her own right too. I could very easily see her as a modified geisha.

[Kristoffer O]

Japanese myth and folklore contains many beings of possible interest. Several kinds of bakemono (something like goblins), the kitsune (fox spirit), tatsu (dragon), oni (demons), yurei (ghosts), uba (hags) and others.

The main diety of the shinto religion is Amaterasu Omi-no-Kami, the sun goddess. But as Hana said Japanese mythology is rather syncretistic and shinto and buddhist beliefs are mixed. Spirits and beings of both religions appear more or less side by side.

Magical beliefs are basically taoistic.

Accidentally I rediscovered the good old japanese RPG 'Bushido' during christmas. I couldn't resist making a campaign for the game (not finished though), so I'm feeling rather Nippon-friendly right now.

If you can find 'Bushido' buy it. It has useful info on society, arms and legendary beings of Japan.

[Endoperez]

This race seems to have troops light in both gold and in resources, and units that need much resources AND others who want much gold. Quite a tricky situation!

Are you sure Death ninja need water magic? Water => quickness...

Interesting. You should try doing graphics: if you try enough, you will eventually get something useful... I do most my essays more than once, and whenever I try to draw I make mostly crap, and sometimes something that I can recognize. You could also ask if Illwinter will let you to change the colors of their dragons.

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by Endoperez:
Are you sure Death ninja need water magic? Water => quickness...

Interesting. You should try doing graphics: if you try enough, you will eventually get something useful... I do most my essays more than once, and whenever I try to draw I make mostly crap, and sometimes something that I can recognize. You could also ask if Illwinter will let you to change the colors of their dragons.

Death Ninja: Yeah... hmmm. I think I'll take it back and make them just death 1 (and cheaper). The wise man already has water, anyway.

As for graphics - that Last part was pretty much assumed=) But it would be fun to get left brain exercise for once. Or right brain, I'm not sure...

Originally posted by atul:
s it so that if you give two weapons to a unit (s)he automatically uses both? If that is the case then here's the nation dedicated to dual-wielding. =) It's just that I've been under impression that in ancient Japan using two swords (long ones, at least) was considered somewhat barbaric. Samurais had katana and short sword, but they weren't used at the same time. Therefore Japan as the nation of dual-wielders strikes me as 'unthematic' (not that it has any relevance to a fantasy setting), but I might very well be wrong. (Of course, for ninjas and ronins everything goes, it's just those samurais with twin katanas...)

While still on that subject, there's this historical figure whose fame was partially owed to the fact he used two swords , Miamoto or something, to succesfully beat a heap of people. Good enough for a hero?

...units always wield as many weapons as they have. But I can give units a piece of armor called a "Wakizashi" that gives +2 defense=) I think I'll make 2 Samurai, ambidextrous (+3, so dual katana still takes a hit) and non-ambidextrous, with ambidextrous ones costing a little more. The non-ambidextrous ones get a piece of armor called a wakizashi, and the dual-wielders get a sword wakizashi, so both get the defense bonus but only dualers get the second attack.

The monks, of course, will all be ambidextrous. But as for dual katanas... should I limit that to "dishonorable ronin"?

Kristoffer and Hana - thanks for the intriguing tidbits=) I'll see how well I can incorporate some of it... a lot might require spell modding, of course... But neither of you mentioned tanukis. I want a tanuki pretender, but I don't really think they're helpful to anyone=) Maybe they should cause bad events (stolen food and artifacts), but cost negative points... or have "Cute +4", like Awe +4, except failing a cuteness throw makes you join the side of the cute one.

Well, I'll try to come up with realistic stats for some of those creatures tonight.

-Cherry

[Arralen]

.. my 0,02 EUR on that matter:

Ninjas
.. oh no, please don't do that. There wheren't any people like black-clad mummy clans which stalked the night.
Those where an "invention" of Hongkong filmmakers who hired some workers from the docks as "sword fodder".

There where some stealthy assassines out there, but they didn't hide in the dark but under the disguise of common men edited: or women . So if you're giving the nation an assasine, make it look like some peasant or something.

dual wielding
It isn't "barbaric" to wield 2 Katana, it's almost impossible. Even using Katana/Wakizashi at the same time is technically difficult, so it's a thing for elite troops only.

2-handed swords
The Katana is basically bastard sword, it can be wielded both 1- and 2-handed. In it's "final" form it's not longer than european Longswords.
However, it's just that the swords got shorter over time. The first Katana, and before them the tachi even more, where 20 to 50cm longer and 2-handed only.

[barbaric swords
Using 2 straight swords was considered barbaric, simply as it was chinese
But was only after ~900, the very first swords in Japan where imported chinese weapons, or derived from those, and had an straight blade.
There's that tale about that "swords of the gods" (cannot remember the name ..) that is described as straight and 2-edged, though.

Everything AFAIK and IMHO, o.c.

yours
Arralen

[ January 06, 2004, 05:13: Message edited by: Arralen ]

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by Arralen:
.. my 0,02 EUR on that matter:

.. oh no, please don't do that. There wheren't any people like black-clad mummy clans which stalked the night.
Those where an "invention" of Hongkong filmmakers who hired some workers from the docks as "sword fodder".

There where some stealthy assassines out there, but they didn't hide in the dark but under the disguise of common men edited: or women . So if you're giving the nation an assasine, make it look like some peasant or something.

Ninjas

Bwahahaha!!! Well, maybe I'll add a new "Ninja of the Dirt Poor Clan that is Forced to Dress Like A Peasant" unit. But all you're doing is encouraging me to add more ninja, not fewer

As for the other info... hmmm. Thanks!

But I have to ask, now. Everyone seems to have good reasons for samurai to not have wakizashis... does anyone know why they did? Were they for blocking, or just a "sidearm"?

-Cherry

[atul]

Originally posted by Saber Cherry:
But I have to ask, now. Everyone seems to have good reasons for samurai to not have wakizashis... does anyone know why they did? Were they for blocking, or just a "sidearm"?

As far as I know: ceremonial purposes, for times their main sword was unavailable (broken/disarmed/etc), close quarter fights. Not used in conjunction, but instead of katana.

As for that 'barbaric' notion, I stand corrected. Anyway, dual-wielding long weapons is featured in films a lot because it is flashy, not because it would actually be a viable way to fight (Uma Thurman in Kill Bill, anyone?-).