Conceptual Balance Mod 1.84 - Page 6

Valerius · #1 September 2nd, 2011, 02:31 AM

I'm ok with nerfing blood. The problem with eliminating SDRs (or even increasing their cost for that matter) is that it impacts some blood nations greatly and others not much at all. A solution that barely impacts Niefel and actually improves their position relative to other blood nations seems flawed to me.

Now you could fix that by, say, making Skratti 1B1W 100% random but that would probably cause an uproar so I agree with you that the proper way to nerf blood is increase the costs of the spells. I don't know that it's all that much work to do since CBM has already adjusted many of the costs so you just change the value. It's a judgement call, but you could take a conservative approach and increase costs by a modest amount. If blood is still a problem just increase the costs a little more next version.

And as far as blood magic goes, I kind of think the main problems with it are with a few summons (autospawning, immortal) and some absurd situations like Jotun having recruit everywhere Claws of Kokytos casters.

thejeff · #2 September 3rd, 2011, 03:40 PM

Well, I don't think you'd empower to B1, unless you don't have any Blood access. Why would anyone who has enough blood to summon & afford Vampire Lords need to empower someone to B1 to hunt?

The only other factor is that Vamp Lords are Blood 7. If you're not a full on Blood nation, you'll likely have Construction4 before you have Blood 7. You may also have blood, but no Blood Death combination.

Executor · #3 September 3rd, 2011, 06:05 PM

I'm also in favor of rebalanced blood prices and bringing back SDRs. These last few posts sum up perfectly why removing them was a bad idea.

As for the blood prices, I think the main problems are vampire lords. Frankly, any blood summon compared to them is hardly worth it. I find them completely OP, I'd increase their price by say 1/3, to 99.
With enough vampires lords you sort of become unconquerable, and with the current price of 66 you can very easily summon 2 to 3 of them a turn meaning that I pity the fool trying to go up against a few dozen vampire lords, probably backed up by a few hundred vampires as well on top of anything that nation might have besides blood.
Also, bone fiends are still OP even with 7 for 3 slaves. It's not really hard to completely trample a nations with them early unless they have powerful archers. Instead of lowering their number I'd suggest an increase in price, say 5.
With their current price you can mass hundreds of them pretty fast even in early game.

Psycho · #4 September 4th, 2011, 02:52 PM

Vampire lords are terribly overpowered at 66 blood slaves. I should know, I've been using them in almost every of my games. The completely useless succubus costs 66 blood slaves FFS.

All devils, both lesser and greater are underpriced as well. The greater ones at least all have limited numbers, so they're not as overpowered as vampire lords. Bone fiends are especially OP among devils with nations with non-capital-only BD mages.

The remaining blood spells are pretty much ok. Maybe dark vines and disease demons could be a bit more expensive, but that's about it.

Deathblob · #5 September 4th, 2011, 06:24 PM

National blood summons (Tlahuelpuchi, Vampire counts) are undercosted too, the Tlahuelpuchi more so than the count.

kianduatha · #6 September 4th, 2011, 09:43 PM

Don't forget Dakini. Ugh.

Samhain · #7 December 5th, 2011, 10:09 PM

I'm having an odd issue with Ember Lords. For at least three turns, two in the same province have refused to move. I've tried for three turns to get them to budge, the last turn attempting to a new location. I've looked at the log file with three levels of debug and nothing jumps out at me. Though, I don't really know what I am looking for. Does anyone have any suggestions on what I should do here?

Soyweiser · #8 January 5th, 2012, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samhain

I'm having an odd issue with Ember Lords. For at least three turns, two in the same province have refused to move. I've tried for three turns to get them to budge, the last turn attempting to a new location. I've looked at the log file with three levels of debug and nothing jumps out at me. Though, I don't really know what I am looking for. Does anyone have any suggestions on what I should do here?

I have had this for meny times also (In the one game I used them). If I tried to use the flying part of the ember lords it didn't work. They only moved if I moved one province at a time.

llamabeast · #9 December 6th, 2011, 06:59 AM

I think this is a generic dominions bug rather than anything to do with Ember Lords. Occasionally units refuse to move like this. It can be extremely frustrating.

Executor · #10 December 6th, 2011, 06:29 PM

Hmm, that explains some pretty strange moments for me...