Beware of Ashdod - Page 7

VedalkenBear · #61 November 29th, 2008, 11:19 AM

On the subject of Blood-9 bless, it's probably most useful when you have literally throw-away sacred troops to use for it. About the only sacred I can think of that fits that category are the ancestors that TC and Sauromatia can summon.

Sombre · #62 November 29th, 2008, 01:42 PM

I tried it with Ulm Reborn and had huge squads of 50+ chaffy sacreds charging around.

And it did nothing pretty much.

MaxWilson · #63 November 29th, 2008, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeldor

And I think cleveland was thinking about nets. I remember fighting Machaka with MA Ermor, nets totally owned shadow vestals, but I doubt they'd work well enough against sacreds [but someone can try that - webs to hold sacreds, some other troops to do the harm].

Lighting should be also a good weapon against Ashdod, they cannot get that protection easily [so don't let them grab that merc with A2

].

Well for whatever reason, the nets didn't seem to do much. I think it's the high Str on the Anakim, plus the fact that "Death Poison" isn't as strong as it sounds.

I agree that Lightning is a good weapon to use against Ashdod, if you've got it. 3 Ahimans (or whatever his expansion group size is) don't kill armies particularly *quickly* so you will hopefully have time to throw a lot of lightning bolts. I don't know that it's cost-effective but it's one of the more feasible counters.

And yes, Ashdod must be denied Obscuro. He will forge them rings of tamed lightning and winged boots, which is bad news.

-Max

MaxWilson · #64 November 29th, 2008, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikelaos

to be fair black hunters are sacred aswell you know? try it again but give the black hunters a major bless, earth is a no brainer with high protection, a bit o nature also works well after the rider dies, but experiment a bit.

Yes, Black Hunters are sacred, but I was not using them as sacred units, I was just curious if Cleveland meant "Black Hunters" when he said "Spider riders." (He probably didn't.) The problem was that the Black Hunters were basically incapable of damaging the Ahimans quickly enough whereas the Ahimans killed the Hunters quite quickly. Adding an E9N9 bless isn't going to change the equation. You're welcome to test it and prove me wrong, but I was already giving Machaka a 3:1 gold cost advantage (450 gold on Ashdod's side vs. 1250 on Machaka's side) so I didn't think it necessary to explore further. Machakan spider riders are not cost-effective vs. appropriately-blessed Ahimans.

And I don't think people play Machaka as a bless nation anyway, do they? E9N8 Black Hunters look cool on paper, but in practice I've found them a bit lacking (N8 doesn't help the rider much, and E9 doesn't help the spider much once the rider is dead). And they're cap-only. I'd rather spend my points on scales.

-Max

P.S. Hmmm. I should mod Machaka so Black Hunters are recruitable anywhere.

P.P.S. I just tried Machakan Hoplites buffed with Strength of Giants. I had high hopes, because regular Hoplites had almost killed one giant in a previous test, but that must have been luck. Hoplites are not cost-effective either. It looks like Machaka's only hope against Ashdod is pretty much to race for Alteration to get Destruction. I'd love to be proven wrong here but I don't see anything other option.

MaxWilson · #65 November 29th, 2008, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sombre

I tried it with Ulm Reborn and had huge squads of 50+ chaffy sacreds charging around.

And it did nothing pretty much.

I think B9 bless is most useful as psychological warfare against opponents who don't hang out on the forums.

-Max

Nikelaos · #66 November 29th, 2008, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxWilson

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikelaos

to be fair black hunters are sacred aswell you know? try it again but give the black hunters a major bless, earth is a no brainer with high protection, a bit o nature also works well after the rider dies, but experiment a bit.

Yes, Black Hunters are sacred, but I was not using them as sacred units, I was just curious if Cleveland meant "Black Hunters" when he said "Spider riders." (He probably didn't.) The problem was that the Black Hunters were basically incapable of damaging the Ahimans quickly enough whereas the Ahimans killed the Hunters quite quickly. Adding an E9N9 bless isn't going to change the equation. You're welcome to test it and prove me wrong, but I was already giving Machaka a 3:1 gold cost advantage (450 gold on Ashdod's side vs. 1250 on Machaka's side) so I didn't think it necessary to explore further. Machakan spider riders are not cost-effective vs. appropriately-blessed Ahimans.

And I don't think people play Machaka as a bless nation anyway, do they? E9N8 Black Hunters look cool on paper, but in practice I've found them a bit lacking (N8 doesn't help the rider much, and E9 doesn't help the spider much once the rider is dead). And they're cap-only. I'd rather spend my points on scales.

-Max

P.S. Hmmm. I should mod Machaka so Black Hunters are recruitable anywhere.

you're right, i could have swore he said something bout spiders though and it didn't seem fair testing spiders with f4/e4 bless (those were the paths on his scorpian king IIRC) against ahrimans with E9/N6.

cleveland · #67 November 29th, 2008, 03:53 PM

*laughs maniacally*

Endoperez · #68 November 29th, 2008, 04:09 PM

Cleveland's Guide to Machaka, or How I Learned to Stop Worrying And Achieve Victory Through Psychological Manipulation

MaxWilson · #69 November 29th, 2008, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikelaos

you're right, i could have swore he said something bout spiders though and it didn't seem fair testing spiders with f4/e4 bless (those were the paths on his scorpian king IIRC) against ahrimans with E9/N6.

E10, not E9. Ashdod is one of the rare cases where E10 is worth it. Otherwise Ahimans pick up 1 fatigue per turn of battle and eventually die to chaff units. It helps in other places too, like trampling Ophanim.

-Max

P.S. Heh heh heh. I'm going to call them "Ahrimans" from now on too, because they are. Death-bringers, that is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by http://www.themystica.com/mythical-folk/articles/ahriman.html

Ahriman, the principle of evil in Persian mythology, was personified as Angra Mainya, "the destructive spirit," who introduced death into the world. He led the forces of evil against the host of Spenta Mainya, "the holy spirit," who assisted Ahura Mazdah, "the wise lord" and final victor in the cosmic war.

AreaOfEffect · #70 November 29th, 2008, 06:57 PM

I've recently achieved a massively cost effect victory against Ashdod using MA Mictlan. However, it doesn't really count as much as I'm using spells like Will of Fates, Relief, Grip of Winter, and Steller Cascade spam thanks to a Banner of the Norther Star.

What I will say is that you don't need to stack on a lot of damage on the Eagle warriors (or on anything really) if you can combine Conjuration 4/Construction 6 with Evocation 5. Use Steller Cascades to soften up the sacreds and then follow it up with a lot of attacks. the fatigue will lower their defense and increase the critical hit chance to allow you to get through the armor.

FYI: Ashdod army lost 14 out of 19 commanders and 68 units out of 69. I lost 42 Eagle warriors out of about 235 and I lost no commanders. Ashdod's bless is E9N6S6. Mine is E9S9. Notice, no blood, no death, and no fire.