Balance Mod Available for SE:V

[se5a]

kwok, can you add 'retroserries design' to the list of design types?

[Captain Kwok]

Greetings!

I'm re-working some of the AI's designs for the next mod update to go with this week's upcoming SE:V patch, so I'd appreciate some thoughts or comments on generally effective combat designs etc.

I've mirror this topic on the BM's SE.net forums as well:
http://www.spaceempires.net/home/ftopict-2529.html

[Tnargversion2]

Captain Kwok said:
Greetings!

I'm re-working some of the AI's designs for the next mod update to go with this week's upcoming SE:V patch, so I'd appreciate some thoughts or comments on generally effective combat designs etc.

I've mirror this topic on the BM's SE.net forums as well:
http://www.spaceempires.net/home/ftopict-2529.html

Not sure if this is what you mean, but are there races that build off of certain doctrines?

Example would be races that rely heavily on fighters and carrier tech.

Races that build vast armadas of fast, agile, smaller frigates and destroyers that swarm convential fleets.

Races that rely on slow, uber armored juggernauts with massive mount weapons but have fleets that employ PD and light weaponry escourts.

Races that research particular styles of weapons and then stick with that particular weapon (CSM, Torpedo, DUC, APB, Ion, ect.). Like the indivdiual raes in the Star Trek Mod that had their own racial weapons.

A sly race that is known through out the galaxy for their deployment of cloaked drone launchers.

An aggressive race that gains its research through capturing other vessels and then analyzing it.

Races bent on researching unconventional weapons such as planet and star destroyers.

Purely defensive style races that rely heavily on Warp Point Defense Bases and Defensive style ships.

Slaving races that build fleets simply to capture planets effectively with the races intact.

A jack of all trades race that knows how to balance all of the above with a good mix of everything to counter just about everything, but only just average at doing these tasks.

Do you know if the new patch is going to address the fact that some of the areas of the strategies can not be adjusted as of 1.33. If so I had some good ideas for fighter strategies and design that seemed to work great in the simulator prior to 1.33.

[aegisx]

I think what needs to happen is the modifiers for 'wanting of a design' need to be exported to the race files. This would allow all sorts of custom AI's to be built (i.e. Borg, Zerg types).

[phalzyr]

Kwok: I gave up on my mod because of the error I mentioned, and reverted back to your originally 1.05 version. I noticed that it even happens with your version though not nearly as good of a chance. I started a game with high computer players (is that 12 or 14... with yours...) Anyway after doing a comparison and making sure everyone started with max resources I ended my turn. Very next turn I did a comparison and saw that 2 of them had only 600 resource lost all research points etc just as it was doing with mine. (note I did an reinstall prior to this). Is it doing the same thing for everyone else? 2 outta 14 isn't taht noticable in the long run but after my mod tweaking your code it got to be over 50% of computer player auto suiciding like this. I will download latest version today and make sure (delete dir and everything to make sure I have a competely clean install, I've been doing everything in the mod dir like I'm suppossed to but who knows...) and then see if it still hapenns.

Oh forgot to mention, when I was doing this with mine I noticed it was somewhat random not set. Once the eee committed suicide the next game they didn't but some one else did in their place...

[Tim_Ward]

Captain Kwok said:
Greetings!

I'm re-working some of the AI's designs for the next mod update to go with this week's upcoming SE:V patch, so I'd appreciate some thoughts or comments on generally effective combat designs etc.

I've mirror this topic on the BM's SE.net forums as well:
http://www.spaceempires.net/home/ftopict-2529.html

Frigates make the best missle boats, because there aren't mounts for missiles and they're the fastest hull size. Early game, I use: bridge, life support, crew quaters, sensors, five engines, five armour, two plasma missiles. Can't beat 'em for damage output, and they outrange everything else. They'd be vunerable to fighters, but they AI doesn't use them too much at present. You can always add in a point defence version with only one missile, two point defence cannons and combat sensors.

Since you're using the quadrent mod, you need to make sure AI's keep a stock of cruisers or something around even if they have dreadnaughts and baseships, if they don't already.

No shields until shield regenerators, to compliment rather than replace armour.

No mixing direct fire weapons with missiles, because missiles work best from afar and you can't use direct fire weapons from all the way back there But you mentioned you were going to do that.

Is the AI going to be using troops?

[Baron Munchausen]

I have started a new game with 1.06 and the 1.35 beta patch. So far, the AI is quite a challenge. Dramatically better than stock. Good thing I didn't give any AI bonus in game setup this time. I have to agree that the designs with mixed missile/direct fire weapons are a mistake, as is using shields before they have reached the same level of effectiveness as armor.

Also, the AI needs to 'cleanup' more effectively after combat. My presence on a certain planet is disturbing a rival empire, and so it's under constant attack. After almost every battle, there is something 'left over' and sitting next to my planet. Supply ship, repair ship, etc. These should be sent home, not left sitting there like orphans. Sometimes I send some ships out to attack and destroy these logistics ships, but usually I'm too busy preparing for the next attack.

[se5a]

yeah I'm wondering if you shouldn't make shields a tad more powerfull Kwok, they need to be a bit less powerfull than armor at the same amount of reserch points though, since you don't have to repair them. duno, what do you others think? anyone worked out the reserch cost of the first level of shields, and what the equvelent armor level is for the same amount of reserch is?

[phalzyr]

Captain Kwok: I did some more reasearch, and can not only describe the issue better but can point to the exact part of your code that causes it, and how to easily recreate it, and even how to fix it , and yes it still happens in 1.06 clean install.

Problem: After first turn, and possibly at other times during the game An AI player home planet and possibly other planets will scrap some or all facilties on said planet. I've only noticed it after first turn since it shows their starting points and stuff only deal with the homeworld and very easy to see the issue...

Cause: In the Script_AI_Construction.txt empire script file under the Remove_Uneeded_Items function is a call to check for and clear up room for a resupply depot and Space port. That area of code causes the problem, specifically not clearing last_colony_id. this still doesn't explain those 3/14 hitting this if routine but if fixed by below method it'll make them only scrap one facility instead of all. (they should all start with both facilities yet randomly, or at least I couldn't see a reason in how long I looked at it, the code falls through to the if anyway...)

Recreate: Simply change the homeworld starting facilites to not include a space port. 90% chance an AI will self-destruct as I call it.

Solution: clearing the last_colony_id right after the "if (found_item) then" routine or at start of loop.

Some Thoughts: This if it isn't just restricted to homeworld could majorally cripple the AI, and if I read the code correctly I assume it runs each turn to check all systems for said facilites? I hope this helps, if you have any questions feel free to ask .

More detail (probaly too much):

Please ignore me if I'm way off or read the code wrong. You loop through each system as long as a person has one planet period. the first thing you do each loop is set found_space to false. Then if no owned planet is in that system it will remain false and go into next loop that deletes a facility. So... As many facilities as there are systems, minus the one they really have a colony in, and minus which system number they are in, are removed. I.E. their colony is in system 248 of a 250 system, they'd loose 2 facilities, since it got to 248 sets the last_colony_id then does two more systems setting found_space to false then next if checks this value and removes a facility for last_colony_id for the last two systems since no planet is found in system it doesn't change the id and thus last planet it checked gets a facility axed...

BTW out of curiousity how often does this part of script fire?

[Captain Kwok]

Can you tell me if the races that self-destructed on the first turn had the Natural Merchants trait?