OT: BSE (aka Mad Cow Disease) in the US

[Renegade 13]

Seeing as how I live in Canada, and am the son of a cattle rancher, I'm wondering what the rest of the world (or at least you guys) think about the BSE case in Canada. Is anybody really worried about mad cow disease? Has anybody even heard of it? Does anyone actually know the problems it is causing to one of Canada's largest industries???

Anyways, I'd like to know what people think about this situation, rather than hearing the slanted views of the media.

Renegade

[ December 24, 2003, 17:13: Message edited by: Renegade 13 ]

[DavidG]

Well as a Canadian yea I know. (see my sig, inspire my Grandpa Kims sig) And if friggen pisses me off!! I will think twice before I buy anything made in Japan since they appear to be the reason why exports to the US are still Banned.

[Arkcon]

*SIGH* I don't eat the brains. I cook my beef before eating. I don't believe disease jumps the species barrier that easy. The limited incidence suggests a more complete study of the epidimiology is needed.

OK, so people can come up with a lot of objections to my reasons. But frankly, I don't think there's a lot of good science behind the connection between BSE and variant CJD.

It's right up there with EMF health risks.

[Jack Simth]

Last I heard, the current working hypothesis on what exactly causes BSE (several months ago, at least; some of this could be off):

A single protien, a warped form of one occuring naturally in most mammals. Specifically, the protien is warped in such a way that when it encounters the normal Version, it warps the normal Version into the warped Version. Unfortunately, the normal protien is necessary for nerve function, and the warped Version doesn't do that function. As a single protien, we don't know of any method to destroy them all. Heat will destroy some, but not all, of them. Chemicals will destroy some, but not all, of them. Radiation will destroy some, but not all, of them. Unfortunately, one is all it takes. Cooking infected meat won't help much.

[Baron Munchausen]

Yep, BSE is caused by a prion. It developed from scrapie, a similar disease in sheep, because of the practice of feeding the rendered leftovers of slaughter to other livestock. Admittedly it took a while, so prion diseases are not easily transmissible from one species to another, but it does occur. Similarly, the largest spike in 'variant CJD' in the world is currently occuring in Britain where they had this huge problem with BSE. It's small by epidemic standards (a few hundred cases) but quite signifigant in proportional terms. This is the reason for the strict standards in US livestock industry forbidding feeding the remains of animals to other animals.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

well, it seems simple to me. cows are herbivores. herbivores eat plants. so, don't feed meat to herbivores.

[Renegade 13]

Originally posted by Baron Munchausen:
Yep, BSE is caused by a prion. It developed from scrapie, a similar disease in sheep, because of the practice of feeding the rendered leftovers of slaughter to other livestock. Admittedly it took a while, so prion diseases are not easily transmissible from one species to another, but it does occur. Similarly, the largest spike in 'variant CJD' in the world is currently occuring in Britain where they had this huge problem with BSE. It's small by epidemic standards (a few hundred cases) but quite signifigant in proportional terms. This is the reason for the strict standards in US livestock industry forbidding feeding the remains of animals to other animals.

In Canada, the practice of feeding the rendered leftovers of slaughtered animals to other animals was made illegal in 1997. However, in the United States, the practice is still (I believe, correct me if I'm wrong) in effect. Also, the US has 10 times the number of cattle than Canada does, therefore the odds are the US has many undetected cases of BSE lurking somewhere. Personally, the whole idea of getting BSE from animals doesn't worry me. Very, very few people die from v.CJD from eating contaminated meat.
However, if you look at food poisoning, lots of people die each week from that illness, and yet we never hear anything about that in the news. Much of the hype has to do with calling it "Mad Cow Disease". I think that's at least half the problem.

[jimbob]

the mouse has a good point, one that's finally been taken by the Canadian governments. Anything in the pipeline now might have BSE, but anything being bred right now won't. Of course you won't see a BSE animal coming out of Britian, USA or Canada cause they're all slaughtered before the age of 3 yrs... just before symptoms would present themselves In truth there are probably 1 in a million spontaneous cases of BSE, but we don't see them cause the animals are too young. The Canadian example was likely a spontaneous case (thought the press never reported this) that just happened to be geriatric.

[quote]A single protien, a warped form of one occuring naturally in most mammals... As a single protien, we don't know of any method to destroy them all... Unfortunately, one is all it takes. Cooking infected meat won't help much.[quote]

It's a single type of protein all right. The protein is very stable when misfolded, so again, you're right, there's no way to denature all the misfolded Versions (unless you like eating charcoal ). However, one misfolded protein is not enough. Well, it is enough, but because the disease is based upon cascading misfolding, you need to be infected by a reasonable dose for the symptoms to be seen. That is to say, if you were infected by a single prion, and lived to be 10 million years old, yes you could develop the disease. Otherwise, 1 million or so misfolded proteins will have no noticable affect on your physiology.

Also the rate of spontaneous misfolding is relatively rare, so eating any mammal could potentially give you this disease. In fact being a mammal could be a problem if you want to avoid BSE and it's analogues completely

[Renegade 13]

A good point has been made. The odds of getting v.CJD from a single case of BSE is something like one chance in 10 billion. And the Canadian case never hit the food chain--in any way. In my opinion, there is no reason why the US border shouldn't be opened to Canadian beef immediately. But hey, I'm prejudiced

[TerranC]

Originally posted by Renegade 13:
In my opinion, there is no reason why the US border shouldn't be opened to Canadian beef immediately. But hey, I'm prejudiced

If that happens, the Japanese will freak and close the border on North American beef.

Canada loses, America loses, Brazil wins :|

(No offense to all you brazilians. It just seems to me that whatever happens, brazil won't be affected by all this stupidity.)

Edit: BTW, how many countries have opened the border yet? I know Japan hasn't, but that Mexico has and America has partially opened up. I think most of the other countries have opened up but I'm not sure.

[ October 09, 2003, 03:40: Message edited by: TerranC ]