Helheim advice

[archaeolept]

expanding w/ 5 blessed helhirdlings shouldn't be difficult w/ an ok bless. you can try going all out w/ f9e9 imprisoned cyclops and see if you still can't expand...

they can try drain2 and hope to have skull mentors pull them up... but this is a very risky strat, and I can't whole-heartedly support it.

[Executor]

Well in any game I played Helheim was always almost last in provinces number in the beginning.
They seem to have a problem massing those couple of sacreds the first few turns.
What do they cost, around 100 for the cavalry, and valkyras are 60 I think.

Never played them, so I'm probably wrong, but if would take several turns to make 2 or 3 armies that are capable of taking provinces with no loses.
They seem to have a bad first few turns start.

[thejeff]

Valkyries are 60, Helhirdings 90.
If you're going double-bless you won't have an awake SC, which slows down those initial turns.

I just played a quick first year with the classic W9F9 bless. Only 12 provinces, but I'd started fighting an AI and made a couple of dumb mistakes, snuck instead of attacking, that kind of thing.
My initial expansion army w/prophet & 2 Helhirdings from the first turn was still going strong. The others had 5/6 mixed Helhirdings & Valks led by a Vanherse. The weakness is archers. They'd probably do better with a few Serf warriors to catch arrows. That would keep me from sneaking when I didn't want to, as well.

I bought mostly Helhirdings and a few Valkyries when the gold split easier that way. Roughly a force every other turn.

The mixed Helhirdings and Valkyries worked better than I thought. I was afraid the valks would fly up and get killed before the cavalry caught up, but with everyone in the back on Hold&Attack closest so they'd have time to get blessed, the enemy would usually get into the cavalry's amazing range. So the Valkyries would appear next to them and then the Helhirdings would race across half the field and cut them down.

[MaxWilson]

Originally Posted by Edratman

I haven't played Helheim since svard's were nerfed to cap only units. They were my favorite nation before that patch. I'm still sulking.

Heh heh. Me too. But I always did like E9D9 Helhirdings.

Don't forget the Bloodstones. Helheim should have a strong Earth gem economy. Disir can escort Iron Dragons to hotspots, and Siege Golems help break down forts that small groups of Helhirdings can't crack alone. Weapons of Sharpness and Petrify are possibilities, although less so now that there are fewer Svartalfs.

-Max

[MaxWilson]

Originally Posted by Executor

Well in any game I played Helheim was always almost last in provinces number in the beginning.
They seem to have a problem massing those couple of sacreds the first few turns.
What do they cost, around 100 for the cavalry, and valkyras are 60 I think.

Never played them, so I'm probably wrong, but if would take several turns to make 2 or 3 armies that are capable of taking provinces with no loses.
They seem to have a bad first few turns start.

Helheim benefits from cranking up taxes to 170 on the first turn and patrolling. The slight decrease in pop is worth getting over that initial problem with cash shortage.

-Max

[chrispedersen]

No experience playing hellheim at all. But I look at the costs on the units and say.. too expensive to compete with a real bless nation.

[Olive]

Maybe a minor Air bless (4-5-6) would help, as Hangadrotts with A4 able to forge air boosters / staffs of storms are sorely missed (1/160 chance).

Edit : or you can rely on a FW bless to forge an elemental staff...

[archaeolept]

Originally Posted by chrispedersen

No experience playing hellheim at all. But I look at the costs on the units and say.. too expensive to compete with a real bless nation.

lol, money is tight for all the van nations, but you can't say helheim isn't a real blesser. a good bless and 4 of those guys will do well against indies. also, stealthy. they're a nightmare to "put down".

[Olive]

OK, I've tested a game with a good E9S9 bless, blessed Helhirdings are great for early expansion, I suffer casualties with valkyries fighting indies set at 8.

But then, what ? When most of the indies are conquered and midgame arrives, what do I do ?

- I've great sacreds, but cap only, so too few to rely on them.
- Normal infantry seems too expensive for what it's worth.
- Still not able to summon lot of stuff.

How do you prepare for midgame ?

[Sombre]

I don't think there are too few sacreds to help much. No-one is going to want to attack you alone and you can pretty much trash a neighbour in a few turns by sneak taking a load of provinces off them.

Iirc it isn't like they have weak magic either.