Proportions....

[PvK]

Sure, but a couple thousand fighters still require over a million resources, and corresponding construction time, and ships to move them between systems. I can think of lots of things for that investment that are also scary.

PvK

[oleg]

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:

quote:

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Originally posted by oleg:
I also like how PvK design fighter weapons. In short, there are two Groups: high accuracy, low damage weapons like small APB, DUC. They are optimal for interceptors but not very efficient against ships.

This Last statement depends on how many you happen to have built. If you are using Fyron's Quadrant Mod, the abundance of asteroids makes it easy to afford thousands of fighters, which make even low damage weapons very scary.

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But Prpoprtions has very effective emissive armour (high level armour plating, IIRC).
That or 4-5 CA makes ship almost immune to average sized fighter stack, say 10, if fighters use damage 4 weapons.

[PvK]

True. However, you can get much larger stacks if you launch during strategic movement, particularly from planets. This deployment method has similar effects to deploying heavy anti-ship weapons, but less efficiently. That is, these mobs become more effective against ships than other fighters, because while they can concentrate fire to bLast through heavy armor plating, if they fight other fighters which are deployed in smaller Groups, they will tend to waste shots, since they can only target one enemy fighter group at a time, while the fighters in smaller Groups will never waste firepower firing into a huge stack of fighters.

Also remember that it's not hard to make ships with lots of structure and/or shields in Proportions, using armored structure, which at lower tech levels is very cheap (20/40/80 mins for 60/90/120 structure in a 10kT component). I think there are several designs and methods which can deal efficiently with fighters, without making them at all obsolete. Fleets that are unprepared for fighters though can get completely smashed by them, though. This is exactly what you see in a lot of sci-fi, btw. That is, practically any sci-fi which includes fighters, makes them quite dangerous to ships, especially if they lack their own fighters or other countermeasures.

PvK

[oleg]

Originally posted by PvK:
This is exactly what you see in a lot of sci-fi, btw. That is, practically any sci-fi which includes fighters, makes them quite dangerous to ships, especially if they lack their own fighters or other countermeasures.

PvK

Exactly. "In Death Ground" by S.White&D.Weber is a very good example. Actually, so far that book is a best story writen about SEIV game

[PsychoTechFreak]

PvK, your 1kT troops bring up another idea, maybe this is possible:

What if you could create 1kT Fighters which in fact are 1-man invasion troops with a backpack jet propulsion (I am not sure about the term)?

That would be a nice one.

[PvK]

PTF, are you talking about planetary fighters, a variety of "troops" that help capture planets?

PvK

[MacLeod]

Originally posted by PvK:

quote:

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Originally posted by MacLeod:
And why is it set so AI's won't surrender except against the most absolutely absurd odds (10000 to 1). Means there nothing left to do with them but destroy them and that's just a boring waste

Because the hard-coded AI logic would otherwise have intact homeworlds surrendering to aliens who did something like:

1) Blockade their homeworld
2) Build many large ships, even unarmed colony ships, causing the score to tip extremely, even though the high-score empire doesn't really pose a particular threat to the AI.
3) or other silliness

Also, an AI surrender of an intact homeworld, particularly to a human player, is a major game event with major effects in Proportions. It also allows both homeworlds to directly add their research, multiplying research rate, which is something the rest of the mod tries to tone down.

So, the idea is if you want that massive prize, you may have to actually earn it and not take advantage of AI foolishness.

PvK

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Aye, but as it is, the AI is basically unable to surrender as it would require at minimum 40,000 points.
Surrender, I'm pretty sure, it disablable in the game settings, so it's kind of redundant and removes the choice.

PTF, you mean a fighter that can invade a planet? As long as fighters can hold cargo that should be doable, give them one cargo so they can hold a single troop. However, chances are fighters can't