SE4 Stock Balance Mod

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by spoon:

quote:

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Originally posted by geoschmo:

quote:

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Originally posted by tesco samoa:
will you adjust the cost of ppb.

as the cost of ppb is the current balance on it.

Well, I think the prevailing opinion seems to be that the cost as it is does not do enough to balance it.

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I think what he is saying is that MM used the high rad cost to balance the PPB, so if you don't think it is balanced now, just raise the rad cost to a higher level.

Very good idea.

Current cost is 300 rad (lvl 5). maybe raise it to 500 (equal to its min cost) and leave everything else as is (well, maybe reduce it's lvl 1 and lvl2 ranges, as suggested earlier...)

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What I got from his post, and from previous conversations he has been involved in, was that he disagrees with both of us and thinks it's balanced sufficently as it is by the higher mineral and rad values. And that if we decrease the combat strength of the weapon we should also decrease the costs accordingly. I think most people would feel that combination of changes would be at best neutral.

Geoschmo

[PvK]

Meson BLaster is a good weapon. It is better than the PPB if your opponent has no unphased shields, except perhaps at range 1, but often not much fleet combat is firing at range 1. It is better than PPB because it is cheaper, and more versatile for designs. On ships with multiplex tracking, it is also better because there is less damage per shot, meaning less wasted damage on overkill.

APB XII, MB V+, and PPB II+ are three of the best all-around weapons in the unmodded game. In surverying all the many other weapons in the game, many of them are much less effificent. Quibbling about how MB should be better is missing the point, unless you're abandoning the other weapons as too much work to even think about.

My current suggestion:

APB - Slightly reduce damage at highest levels (low levels are weak enough)

MB - leave alone

PPB - smooth improvement rate (as in SJ post), increase research cost significantly, increase resource cost a bit

Grav Hellbore - skip all shields, perhaps increase damage

Ripper Beam - Ok as is, though they could have more damage and less range (more like SE3, but not necessary)

Incinerator - Increase damage

Wave Motion Gun - maybe increase damage

Torpedo - increase damage and/or accuracy (do not make ROF 1)

Energy Magnifier, Acid Globule, Enveloping Acid Globule, etc - make sure torpedo and Graviton Hellbore improvements don't make these weapons obsolete.

Seekers - use the new Settings.txt ability from Last patch to give seekers a defensive to-hit bonus.

PD - reduce to-hit bonus to +30

Fighters - increase defensive bonus by perhaps 20 or so.

Massive Planetary Shield - shields x20 or more

PvK

[Fyron]

Spoon did have a good point. Changing the cost of PPB by a little bit is NOT going to go anywhere near actually improving the balance of the game to be better than it is now. Some big changes (according to your scale, not mine) have to be made, or this is all pointless.

APB XII, MB V+, and PPB II+ are three of the best all-around weapons in the unmodded game. In surverying all the many other weapons in the game, many of them are much less effificent. Quibbling about how MB should be better is missing the point, unless you're abandoning the other weapons as too much work to even think about.

Exactly.

[Suicide Junkie]

Energy Magnifier, Acid Globule, Enveloping Acid Globule, etc - make sure torpedo and Graviton Hellbore improvements don't make these weapons obsolete.

I'd say they should match any changes made to the most similar regular component.
HEM <-> WMG for example.

As for the WMG, I think a range increase would be best, (considering the scale changes from SE3 they should have about 14-16 range)... Its a low damage, slow reload artillery beam, really. Problem is APBs have 8 range too.

[mac5732]

In regards to PDC being to strong, maybe instead of reducing, just add a random miss modifier of say 10-15%, that way you do not always hit but have a chance of missing, this along with increaseing the size/capacity of ftrs in med and large level make this more balance IMHO. Or with ftrs you could reduce the size of their components to fit more in.

Hellbore, maybe small increase in damage, but increase range and have it firer every 2 turns instead of 3, this would give it more meaning to use.

Also in regards to PD vs seekers/ftrs/missles, the way it currently is PD's are not the only things that can target these types. Suggestion, make PD's only good against them with no other weapons being able to target them, or some type of llimit on the other weapons that can also target these. Later in games, in SP play, PD's are worthless because the other weapons can fire at the seeekers/ftrs/sats as well as other ships, therefore why use them? Point I'm trying to make, either limit seekers/ftrs/sats to only be fired on by PDC's, eliminate other weaspons having these capabilities, or at least cutting back on other weapons that have these capabilities.

just some ideas Mac

[Fyron]

Mac, the random miss modifier would be lowering its inate to hit bonus.

[Taera]

where is the thread at right now? i am not realy going to read through the whole 11 pages, but i myself had been considering such a mod for some time. if theres one being made, i'll give a hand.

What do you have so far? what is being discussed now?