How Low Will The Lawyers Go?

[Atrocities]

The problem with these ambulance chasers now is that when people are really hurt in an accident, they lose in court.

You cannot tell a jury you are suing an insurance company.

You cannot tell a jury you are suing because you have no income and need your medical cost covered that have gone beyond PIP.

The Insurance Company can utterly destroy your credibility because you did not go see a doctor, or failed to keep an appointment, taking comments made to medical staff out of context, and editing video depositions so they "fit" the insurance companies lie.

They can do this because you are powerless, by court order and law, from telling the whole story. That you did not go to the doctor because your PIP coverage had maxed out and any more medication or doctors visits were your responsibility to pay for.

The laws work both ways, they are designed to make truth subjective. Which ever lawyer can present the best "show" wins.

Tabbacoo companies are the lowest form of life on earth and what they did to make Tobacco more addictive was out of pure evil. The Trial lawyers just cashed in on it.

I agree that tort reform is needed, but when law is subject to preseved truth, then justice is no longer blind. An inocent man can be convicted for a crime he did not commit because of subjective turth.

A man seriously injured in a car accident looses his case in court because the Insurance Lawyers have all the laws in there favor. BIG MONEY buys the laws.

I believe that our jury system is broken, and I know that our crimial and civil law systems are utterly bog down in BS.

If a person if tried for a crime, and they are found inocent, or aquitted, then the State should pay for there financial losses incurred as a result of the trial.

To many times to many people have lost everything they own to lawyers and court cost for utterly BS reasons.

As long as we continue to accept our system of justice as is, we will continue to see more and more abuses of the system for those who can afford the price of justice.

Simply put, how much justice are you willing to pay for? In the case of trial lawyers, a lot because the pay off is even bigger.

[ January 29, 2004, 02:13: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

[narf poit chez BOOM]

yeah, but people do scam the court's by faking injuries and finding a docter to back them up.

[Growltigger]

Atrocities and Narf, I cannot comment on the insurance company/medical issues you are talking about as I know very little about this aspect of the US legal system, and what I do know annoys me. I'll leave it to you chaps to discuss the situation.

Mephisto, me old sauerkraut and bratwurst munching, bitburger swilling teutonic chum, long time no currywurst, how are you doing?

I suggest we leave this topic to a US discussion about their jury trial system.

Mephisto and myself, on behalf of the non-US legal community, have made our position clear. We look on from the outside and think the US systems needs reform rather badly.

IMHO, the first step would be to stop with the blame=damages concept, and divorce the concept of damages=compensation. As long as your legal system allows these speculative cases, it is going to be abused by unscrupulous professionals and people out to make a fast buck. Simple as that.

My personal view? ditch the right of the jury to set what compensation is. Set up two clear criteria, "punishment" and "damages". Punishment is at the discretion of the court, and should not be financial. "Damages" need to be proved, and be realistic to what actually has occurred. You smash my car up with a baseball bat? your punishment is a custodial sentence or a fine, damages equal the cost to me of replacing or repairing my car, not several million dollars (which you probably cant pay anyhow) for my feelings!

Atrocities and Geo, please let me have your full names, social security numbers and residential addresses so that I can instruct my US lawyers (the eminent firm of Robbem, Screwem and Scarper)to issue libel proceedings against the pair of you

[DavidG]

Originally posted by Growltigger:

quote:

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Originally posted by rdouglass:
Just 2 cents....

The truth (as usual) is somewhere there in the middle. Yes lawyers help us (common citizens) out of many legal issues that we are not capable or trained to deal with. And of that we pay you handsomely.

I believe the same applies to pretty much every trade or profession. I could say the same about plumbers, boiler repairmen, carpenters, electricians, surveyors,

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AY CARUMBA! Your lumping surveyors in the same pay class as lawyers? As a surveyor Now I'm offended. (No not really ) Surveyors are not a rich bunch. (of course I aslo know that the term 'surveyor' has a completely different meaning in the UK)

And if AT is gonna change the name of this thread don't be putting in 'American' We have the same kind of crap going on in Canada. The only thing wrong with the name is the term "THE Lawyers" instead of "Some lawyers" One of my best friends is a lawyer and he's a great guy as are I expect 90% of the rest. Unfortunately it's that other 10% (some would say higher, maybe lower) giving the rest a bad name.

I would, however, say the real problem is the judges who award the ridiculous claims. ie giving a guy $600,000 for an accident he was involved in while drunk.

[Growltigger]

DavidG, dunno what surveyors earn but before I met the current Mrs GT, I did go out with a rather nice young surveyor who had a very nice sports car, an expensive flat and cash to burn, as well as rather nice legs.

There is an office of surveyors next to me, and they all seem to drive rather expensive cars!

[rextorres]

It's unfortunate that some politicians and radio pundits have been able to shift the discussion to blame the trial lawyers instead of focusing on companies that act recklessly or criminally while at the same time not insisting that these companies at least be forced to act responsibly.

The whole point of punitive damages (which some here have mistaken as "pain and suffering") is to punish companies for reckless and criminal behavior. Not as some have claimed as a form of a lottery. An analogy would be the speeding ticket. If the fine for a speeding ticket is only $5 you probably would not stop speeding. If it's $100s of dollars is all of a sudden makes you stop and think. Also - you can't throw a company in jail, but you can cause it to pay large sums of money.

The poster child for frivolous lawsuits is McDonald's. What you hear on the radio is that this woman should have known coffee was hot.

What you don't hear about is that McD's to save a couple of pennies on each coffee sold was serving coffee that was needlessly too hot in cups that were notorious for loosing their lid. This woman was not the first to have complained and McD's purposely ignored and dismissed any complaints. In fact McD's didn't even offer an apology or any medical compensation they just hoped the woman would go away. The woman had to go through months of therapy because of these burns. If I had been in that woman's place I would have been mad and you probably would have been too.

The only way to force them to change this reckless practice was through a lawsuit. Tom Delay or Rush Limbaugh sure would not have done anything about it.

A good example of a company that did act responibly is Odwalla and they never paid punitive damages because they acted as a company should. You all can look it up if you are interested.

Anyway - I would suggest that most if not all high punitive damage awards are the result of companies not only producing faulty products but also covering them up to continue to make profits.

I don't know about you but if someone I loved died or suffered extreme harm because of a company's malfeasance I think that company should be held accountable.

Now anyone who thinks that a company should not be held accountable when they knowingly cause extreme harm or death please speak up.

[Mephisto]

IMHO it is still the women’s fault. Anyone can feel from the outside of the cup of coffee that it is hot. It is not the fault of MD that she put it into her lap on way or the other no matter how hot it was. If you drive to fast on the highway it is you that is responsible and not the car company because it build a fast car.

If the company sells malfunctioning products to the public and people suffer from it, the solution is simple (at least over here): The company pays for the damage it caused (and to some extend for physical pain, but seldom more then 20k €). As a punitive, we get the heads of the people responsible that such a product entered the market, be it on purpose or negligence. They will go to jail for it and no legal construct will help them.
Result: The consumer gets his damage replaced and the responsible person will get his punishment. I see absolutely no need to punish the company and all the honest people working for it by enforcing punitive damage on the company when the few people that are responsible can be punished directly. Just my 0.02$

@Growltigger: It going fine over here, a lot of work at the moment as I have completed all my tests and exams in November Last year. I have sworn my oath in January and I’m now a lawyer in all respects of the German law. I got lucky and got a job immediately despite the high unemployment rate here in Germany. Only my free time has suffered in the process.