OT: The Passion of the Christ movie

Raging Deadstar · #1 May 24th, 2004, 11:36 PM

Ok, I'm extremely against religion in all it's forms (although some have redeeming qualitys like buddhism) But i definitely disagree with that Last comment.

Even though i absoloutly deplore homophobia (a lot of my friends are "gay" for lack of a better word, it has such a stigma) and I absoloutly detest the idea of hitting a partner. But however much i dislike their ideals, beliefs and practices they are human after all, and are therefore allowed to believe in what they wish, Human Rights and all.

One day i think we as a race will evolve round the need to believe in a god/gods to explain things and also provide a social/moral code to live by. Of course this is just My Humble Opinion, hopefully one day, even if there is an Omnipotent energy being behind it all (fyron?

) i hope we can just learn to get along! Idealistic and Naive of me perhaps but until then we havn't got much of chance...

So there's my 2 pennies so to speak (I'm english

)

Azselendor · #2 May 25th, 2004, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Atrocities:
I don't know what to say to your post. I honestly pray that no person is being wrongfully held, and or mistreated.

If they are, then hell yes we need a way to litigate their freedom.

Sometimes the idology of better safe than sorry has a human cost that is more often than not over looked.

I wish them all well.

The unfortunate part of this is that suicide rates and prison abuse in these jails - on american soil - are largely ignored and buried away. Some of those people have been thier for years on offenses as minor as speeding or expired tags.

Under current immigration law, homeland security can pull up any offense from 1976 to present (despite the law for this being made in 1996), no matter how minor, and declare it an aggrevated felony. Send thanks to Mcvay family for that.

narf poit chez BOOM · #3 May 25th, 2004, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Grauzone:

quote:
Originally posted by narf poit chez BOOM:
I can recall no instance of 'erase the unbelievers' without human sacrifice being involved. Nor were sinners burnt, that I recall. And the death penalty was only mandatory for adultry and first degree murder.

Compared with other historical law's of the time, I would call Isreal's ancient laws enlightened.

i tell what i read in the bible (doings of GOD not of the people):

burn the sinners -> sodom and gomorra
erase the unbeleavers -> the Flood, death of innocent first burn children, ...

The GOD in the old testament is an good exampe of a very good dictator. Efficient by enforcement of his will and brutal to all "opposition".

The Ten Commandments are as a matter of fact enlightened in this time (most of them in our times too). [/QB]

Considering that there was a mob in sodom and gomorra gathered to rape a couple of people and nobody outside Lot's? house interfered, I think that might be another indicater of why the society was destroyed.

As for the flood? I beleive that to be justified, but I can only base that on my faith in a just God and the general trend in Old Testament history up to that time. You can only base your opposition on a beleif that that many people can't be wrong.

And, in my understanding, the Hebrew people were held to a higher standard than the surounding people. Something they promised.

Urendi Maleldil · #4 May 25th, 2004, 03:22 AM

Religion means nothing. All that matters is what is true. If something is true, it's true for me, true for you, and true for any Martians out there.

Since religions are beliefs about what is true, a religeon must be believed in order to be followed. Few people follow something they believe is false.

It's a bad idea to let your friend go on believing something false about something so important as life, the universe, and everything.

If I believe there is no God, and after you die there's nothing, who cares what other people believe? In my world there's only pleasure and pain. There's no such thing as absolute right and wrong. If I believe something is right, it makes me feel good. If it's wrong it makes me feel bad. Live and let live. That's what I say. The guy down the street believes something else? Don't rock the boat. He should believe what he feels is true. This works for me. I don't push my beliefs on others. That hurts. Both me and them. We can be friends without our opinions getting in the way.

If I believe God is true, then I believe we're in deep doo doo. God is just and justly destroys pride, prejudice, and all the rest of them. We're prideful and prejudicial. Unless God gives us a way out, we're bound for loneliness and sorrow-- utter destruction of your self. All your hopes and dreams shattered for infinity. But God, filled with compassion, provides a just way out. It's a narrow way, but it's straight like a laser. He took the destruction and on himself to set you free from the justice you deserve. My friend down the street doesn't believe this? He's in deep trouble. I have to help him.

In the first instance, I don't really care about what other people believe. I don't believe it's important. You die, you die. That's it. The guy down the street pisses me off 'cause he's always trying to push his "religion" on others. It's a personal thing. I believe there is no God. It's my opinion. All he's doing is causing other people pain.

In the second instance, I care very much about what others believe. It's important because the guy down the street is headed for destruction. I care about this guy. I don't want him to wind up regretting his life for the rest of infinity. If I really care about this guy, I'll do whatever I can to convince this guy that the destruction is real, and that God is real, and that Jesus is real. No matter the pain. Rocking the boat hurts? Suck it up, hombre.

So the degree to which someone will try and convince you of something is proportional to how important they believe that thing to be and how much they care about you, because that's how much pain they will be willing to endure to convince you of it.

Look at Jesus. That's not pain for pain's sake. That's pain for you personally. He must have a five gallon bucket of knowing something up there, 'cause that's a lot of pain. Men like that don't suffer pain for no good reason.

It's tough to believe in because love is so simple. It's easy to think too hard about it and miss the point completely. Children can understand it easily, while some of the greatest minds end up wrestling with it for their whole lives.

Gandalf Parker · #5 May 25th, 2004, 03:33 AM

This thread is nearing the point where someone may be forced to show their wrath and erase all of the unchosen which sully the world which is forum. (threads which are OT)

For if it does make the world unfriendly to those who have sought it out for its declared purpose, only to find it a den of iniquity, then it too shall fade from the world.

Fyron · #6 May 25th, 2004, 05:13 AM

Quote:

If I believe there is no God... There's no such thing as absolute right and wrong.

"God" is not needed to have morality.

[ May 25, 2004, 04:17: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Jack Simth · #7 May 25th, 2004, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:

quote:
If I believe there is no God... There's no such thing as absolute right and wrong.

"God" is not needed to have morality.

He specified a specific sub-class of ethics; the absolute variety. As unproveable fundamental assumptions are unavoidable, some form of authority/authoritative document that is totally trusted (divine) is required for that sub-class - else, when someone recognizes and disagrees with one or more of those fundamental assumptions, there isn't anything that can be said.