Carribean mod

[Goatfoam]

Beck: Thanks, shame about the mines but the fighters are sounding good.

JLS: I wish I could show you the pictures I've already done for the planets, asteroids, whirlpools and all that jazz. They're absolutely pathetic.

Haha.

But yeah, incorporating other areas of the world could be an idea. Maybe even Asia. The Chinese apparently had some of the best naval technology available at the time, and as someone pointed out on #se4, those Chinese pirates from Swiss Family Robinson were very cool.

It will also make Ninja Pirates easier to get away with.

[JLS]

You do the DATA and then I will get the Island, Coastal and Sea Lanes QUAD PICs done for you - OK

From that point you/we will tie it together, if you wish.

[ July 06, 2004, 03:09: Message edited by: JLS ]

[Goatfoam]

Sure JLS, sounds good. I'll get started on those in the morning then.

I was also kicking around the idea of remote mining... It might be a good way to represent piracy, other than Intel projects.

I was thinking maybe there would be a few systems that would basically be "open ocean" that didn't contain fog banks or whirlpools (nebulae and blackholes, respectively), but acted a lot like Asteroid systems.

Anyway, there would be spots on these open stretches of ocean that would represent trade routes. You'd place your ship with a special component on there, and it would generate resources for you each turn. Yes, just like remote mining. But it might be an idea to place a stronger emphasis on it, which each race being specialised in different remote-mining types.

So, for instance, Colonials would be average at collecting wood and food, but better than most in collecting weapons (supply from the mainland).

To be honest, I see established islands as being VERY hard to "glass", and with the vast amount of troop types I intend to include, fairly balanced when attempting to capture an island. These "trade routes" will give players (especially pirates) a target to harass. There would probably need to be some sort of bonus effect for destroying ships with these trade components, which I'll look into tomorrow too.

[JLS]

Best to start small and then add as you go

Think smaller Modules:
1~ Vehicles (Surf Boats-Boarding Barge-Cutter-Brig-Yawl-Sloop - Man of War = one Decker-Two Decker etc. There may be no need to find a need for se4 bases at this time and save for a latter module -You have all the time in the world

~Troops= Lobers, Swabs, Sailors, Marines, Regulars, Pirates (Field Cannons) Etc. - There also may be no need to find a need for Fighters, SATs or Mines at this stage; However Weapon Platforms will make fine on Shore Batteries
- - -
2~ Components= Sail inventory and that Ships rigging Configurations versus Salt Water Hull Displacement may define your Ships Speed. Jib-Staysals-Foresals-Mainsal-Mizzens-Gallants-Topsals and my fav the Spanker
(perhaps, a short combat speed to avoid a weird simulation rush?) Fyron may be best to advise here.
Also to figure a way to represent the "weather gauge" for Combat Advantages.

~Armor for the Hull
~Shields for the boarding and Splinter Nettings

~Weapons= How much weight in metal do you want your Cannons to throw: 4 pounders -8 Pounders-16 Pounders etc. (how many guns per Broad Side and then in total) There is:

Long range Round Shot (accurate and powerful) However, knocks out guns and rarely fatal. Unless the timing is such that the Firing Broadside is on the Down Swell and the shoot is to the windward (to your lee or the target is {just} on the peak of an up swell and few cable lengths away)- so it makes fast below the waterline. (Possibly Weapons Damage as an ability)

Short Range Chain Shot (engine damage) to take out Sails. (not against Planets)

Shorter range Grape Shot (Shield Damaging) and against the Boarding and Splinter Nettings (not against Planets)

Carronades that are inaccurate but will LOB up and then down thru the unarmored Decks and then hole the keel (skip Armor) and great for shore bombardments (extra against Planets) eek:

Smaller Bow and Stern Chasers (not against Planets) And could be very weak and Extra long range - just for the effect.

The very small swiveled Qtr Deck scatter guns - mainly for any unhappy crew or boarding defense and sometimes both at the same time. (Perhaps Boarding Defense and not against Planets)

- - -

3~Facilities: Boat and crews need Drinking WATER, Spars, Sail Cloth, Food, Grog, Line, Blocks etc.

Government House-Trading House-Barracks-Civil Quarters-Fleet Head Quarters-Ship Yards-Hospitals-Impressments Camp-Labor Camps-Harbor Patrols-Harbor Trade-Harbor Work Details Etc.
I like your Resource idea - "Metal, Food and Wood"
Distilleries, Farms, Lumber Works, Mining Camps, Sugar Cane, Spices, Cattle, Textiles...... (Facilities this can be endless
- - -
Research, Intel and Event files can come Last once you have your Core (for the Research, Intel and Event ideas - that will fall into place).
Then the overall balance
Adding the AI (Ship Capture should be a challenge)
Followed by the great shuffle with most of your data
Not to mention the Endless Testings

= = = = = = = =

Research the time Period,
Stay with the time Period...
Start with small Modules and add as you go, keeps it easy and focused.
Above all - Keep the desire.
Then just make it all happen

Now - on deck you scabrous dog, hands to the braces and look lively!!!
Bring us that horizon - then Drink up me hardies, Yoe Hoe



[ July 06, 2004, 08:14: Message edited by: JLS ]

[Fyron]

The Chinese apparently had some of the best naval technology available at the time,

Actually, it was by far the very best, but it was a century or two earlier than this time frame. But, due to an increasingly inward-looking court (China was quite possibly the most powerful empire in history at that time), they allowed their huge navy of massive ships (which dwarfed anything made by Europeans for centuries to come) to essentially rot away. They voluntarily gave up their chance to remain the dominant naval power in the Indian Ocean and Pacific Ocean regions. By the 15th century, China had almost no navy to speak of.

[ July 06, 2004, 07:02: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

[dogscoff]

...gunboats... but for game purposes I wouldn't see a problem given the small number that could be launched this way. You could also have fireships launched in this fashion or as drones.

You could have them launched from ports onlly.

One of the main problems with converting se4 to a ships & sea game (apart from the extensive graphical modifications) has been the difficulty of representing "coastline". You can get round this, of course, by having nothing but open sea witrh a number of small islands (planets) in it. This seems to be the approach you are going for.

However, I wonder if it would be possible to
generate all non-oxygen planets with a massive sector damage ability, so that any ship sailing into "land" is instantly destroyed. You could have huge blocks of "mainland" like this, with oxygen planet "ports" on the edges (ie "the coast"). You could also have uncolonised "ports" which could be settled (caves and harbours to be turned into pirate/smuggler hideouts) and which, over time, would grow into full towns/ ports. (Assuming you build the right facilities and cargo units.)

Of course getting the map generator to place all these items sensibly would probably be nigh-impossible, so these maps would almost have to be hand-sculpted.

[JLS]

Dogscoff, your suggestion is far more practical for a quad map

Hunting Images and then resizing; although, not a priority - will take time. However, what is several days effort compared to the overall effect it will have on the Vehicles, Components and Facilities.

[Goatfoam]

I was thinking about that sort of thing Last night (the large areas of land that destroy ships if they run aground, I mean). I'm not sure how frustrating it would get, but different systems could have different wind factors, which would essentially move a ship in a random direction each turn (probably no more than 2 sectors, with the average being 1). That might turn out to be a dumb idea in the context of fun, though.

Anyway, yes, one thing at a time. I won't have a lot of time to look at it until Thursday, but I've started on the components.txt.

Oh, and also, I had some ideas about cloaking/scanners I'd like to throw out to see whether they would work or not. Remember, these are just ideas for the time being:

I was thinking that cloaking would be an inherent feature anyway, since they wouldn't have had system scanners or anything like that, and often they didn't know the enemy was upon them until they were literally upon them. If there is some way to add a range to sensors then that might be a way to do it - I'm thinking Crows Nest components and Lookout Tower facilities. That would cover visual cloaking.

The other kind I had in mind would be mainly for the pirate races, and would represent infiltrating ships. These wouldn't be as powerful as warships, and it would be inherent in the VehicleSize rather than an added component, with pirate vessels posing as trading ships that would go unmolested until their cargo and manifests were checked out at a checkpoint or a port (some sort of Security Technology tree for the colonials). This would be a good way to provide targets for Piracy Intel, and to check out any aforementioned "trade routes" that may or may not be added later.

I know I'm getting way ahead of myself, but I'm getting quite excited and ideas keep cropping up.

The focus at the moment is still on the basic components, vehicles sizes and facilities, though, definitely. No really!

[narf poit chez BOOM]

I'd be willing to run through your standard system file and make second Versions of them with wind or vice-versa.

[Goatfoam]

That would be great, Narf. Cheers.

JLS- I'm a little confused about the sails. Would a ship require one of each type of sail? I suppose you could restrict each sail type to "one per vehicle", with the mainsail perhaps being the most important (most movement) and the others perhaps adding one movement (or combat movement) each. I was against this, originally, since it seemed to overcomplicate the matter, but the more I think about it the more I'm liking it.

The Salt Water Displacement factor can just be added into the vehiclesizes.txt - I'd imagine a negative "Movement Bonus" ability would work for the larger ships, though I'm not sure if it will work. I'll go test it.